Dice Rifts Adventure OOC

[Silanon]

Didn't even know that it triples in that case... never been on an Aishwarra's back before, it seems. Guess I better do the math, just in case our terrific gm needs it, huh? Just for your covenience, Sherwood : That'd be 228md total, then. Just so you have all the numbers readily available to make your decision, of course...

 

[Purr]

I'd have to go at least a few weeks back to check I think, but I believe Sherwood has you roll the dice, add it up together, then double or triple that amount. I believe he runs by the Rifts game's own rules. Per Rifts Ultimate Edition (page 344), a Critical Strike is in part defined thusly: "A powerful, special or nerve shattering strike that inflicts double the usual amount of damage."

So this is not "double damage dice" as in some games but double (or triple in the case of stacking two Critical Strikes) the total amount of damage (including those nice little crystals you had Eron invest in). =) Also, when using a Paired Weapons Strike one adds the damage for each strike individually. I think you're short-changing yourself by adding Eron's P.S.-based damage and martial arts damage bonuses once instead of twice; Eron is swinging two weapons, one with each arm.

This is yet another reason Palladium games can be so exciting - Critical Strikes can be game-changers! =)

Edited for clarity (and because I'm about to go to bed). =)

 

[Purr]

Silanon
Sherwood, of course, is free to correct me but here's my math on the matter:

Spoiler: Math

Notes for myself:
17+6=23 from Shining Mirror
18 from Valere's blade
15 for Eron's melee damage
-> that's 56, doubled to 112

40 flaming
20 acid

Math time. I don't know the following four things:

1. Which crystals are on which swords (so I just combine the two).
2. If Sherwood rules that this is indeed a Critical Strike from Behind.
3. If the Aishwarra counts as "Supernatural Evil" and is therefore hit for double-dice damage from Shining Mirror.
4. If the Aishwarra has somehow defended from Eron's attack (and therefore negated this whole thing but I like doing the math so I'm having fun!)

23 (Shining Mirror Damage) + 12 (P.S.) +3 (Leopard Style Kung Fu) = 48
18 (Valere) + 12 (P.S.) + 3 (Leopard Style Kung Fu) = 33
60 M.D. from Flaming and Acid crystals.
Base damage: 141 M.D.

Critical Strike (Natural 19) + Critical Strike (from behind if Sherwood so rules) = x3.

141 x 3 = 423 Mega-damage! =)

Add another 23 M.D. if the Aishwarra is indeed counted as "Supernatural Evil" (I think something that eats and procreates via magic is sure as hell as supernatural as it gets! My question is - is it evil-Aligned?), then Shining Mirror adds another 23 M.D. bringing the grand total to 446 M.D. which beats out anything my wonderful Undead Slayer Gradicus ever dished out! =)

Could someone double-check my math? It's late and my brain is tired. =)

 

[Silanon]

I'd have to go at least a few weeks back to check I think, but I believe Sherwood has you roll the dice, add it up together, then double or triple that amount.

Pretty sure that's how it works here in the game - and it's how I did things, too. Rolled once for each blade, and then doubled/tripled.

(including those nice little crystals you had Eron invest in).

Pretty sure Sherwood ruled that these aren't affected by critical hits, i.e. they just offer the flat damage bonus of 1d4x10+10.

I think you're short-changing yourself by adding Eron's P.S.-based damage and martial arts damage bonuses once instead of twice; Eron is swinging two weapons, one with each arm.

That's correct, missed that one. That's +30 on the regula critical hit, and +45 when tripled.

Sherwood, of course, is free to correct me but here's my math on the matter:

Think you're off a little bit - base damage should be 131 md, and without the multiplication on the crystals, we get "only" 273md - which is probably correct since it's what I get when i add the missing 45 to my result above:

That'd be 228md total

It's still a hell lot of pain for the monster; don't think it's supernatural evil, the description sounded more like neutral-stupid.

 

[Silanon]

Forgot two things: Shining Mirror has the fire damage, Valere's blade has the acid.

And, most importantly: Thanks for checking this, Dann! You're awesome.

 

[Purr]

Think you're off a little bit - base damage should be 131 md, and without the multiplication on the crystals, we get "only" 273md - which is probably correct since it's what I get when i add the missing 45 to my result above:

I'm O.K. with being off! It's late and I've been using my brain aaall daaay! Hee hee! =)

Pretty sure Sherwood ruled that these aren't affected by critical hits, i.e. they just offer the flat damage bonus of 1d4x10+10.

I'll take your word on it! =)

And, most importantly: Thanks for checking this, Dann! You're awesome.

Heh, you're welcome, Sil! I love to roleplay and I love to help out buddies and those are two really nice things I get to do when I'm here on RP Nation! =)

 

[Purr]

It's still a hell lot of pain for the monster; don't think it's supernatural evil, the description sounded more like neutral-stupid.

We may find out when Sherwood tells us what Shining Mirror did. Rune blades are almost always empathic. Unless Sherwood is running them differently, it'll probably let Eron know. Wait. Hasn't Eron struck it before? Was that added in?

Math strikes again! Ha ha! =)

 

[Sherwood]

Wow that's a lot of damage. Just so you know for when you run into another Aishwarra, they do not count as supernatural evil, just regular evil. So the damage bonus of the sword does not apply to them. IC post coming up.

 

[Silanon]

Somehow, that sounds like there's an entire herd of them incoming; or maybe I'm just too pessimistic...

 

[Silanon]

Sherwood What would Eron know about freeing potentially swallowed victims of the Aishwarra?

 

[Purr]

Somehow, that sounds like there's an entire herd of them incoming; or maybe I'm just too pessimistic...

Just so you know for when you run into another Aishwarra,

Sil, I don't think that's pessimistic - he didn't say "if,;" he said "when." "When" implies that there is definitely more than one and maybe in our area.

Sherwood

Just so you know for when you run into another Aishwarra, they do not count as supernatural evil, just regular evil. So the damage bonus of the sword does not apply to them.

Okay, no more beating around the bush. Sherwood, I hereby request your definition of "supernatural evil."

Spoiler: The nuts and bolts of this confusion.

Sherwood, you want to balance your game? Cool. I can relate. It's not the damage bonus I'm concerned with; it's what your definition of supernatural evil is. "Supernatural evil." I'm not confused about the evil part. Is the creature in question Miscreant, Aberrant, or Diabolic? If so, it's evil! Right? If an Aishwarra is "regular evil," then you're saying it is no more supernatural than, say, a rabid dog.

Webster's dictionary states the definition of "supernatural" is:

"Definition of supernatural​

1: of or relating to an order of existence beyond the visible observable universe especially: of or relating to God or a god, demigod, spirit, or devil

2a: departing from what is usual or normal especially so as to appear to transcend the laws of nature

b: attributed to an invisible agent (such as a ghost or spirit)"

Folks? In my admittedly messed-up head, anything that eats magic and has kids via magic is big-time "departing from what is usual or normal especially so as to appear to transcend the laws of nature." Normal ("natural") people and animals cannot do this. A human psychopath? Not supernatural. A robot? Not evil or supernatural. A vampire? Clearly supernatural (hence the word super), but may or may not be evil. Aishwarra? If this isn't supernatural, what is?

So I am requesting two important things to clear this up, please?

1. What is Sherwood's definition of the word supernatural as it is to be used in this Rifts game?

2. Sherwood, would you rather just change the power of the sword (or any other items we come across that have like ability) to state something you're more comfortable with for the sake of game balance? Say, "double dice damage only to..." and you put in whatever you want to balance your game?

 

[Silanon]

I'd actually be interested if it's evil at all - from what we know, it's more of an animalistic thinking that's hard to judge via alignment at all, right? For example, I wouldn't call ants evil, even though they kill and have 'slaves' (some plant louses or something like that, can't recall the details right now). There's a reason why animals in Pathfinder are neutral - Rifts doesn't have that alignment for characters, but I'm not sure how much 'character' the Aishwarra even has.

 

[Silanon]

Oh crap, sorry - I was too stupid to read Sherwood's post. Whoops.

 

[Sherwood]

The 'supernatural evil' aspect of the sword is geared to be able to do more damage to demons, devils, vampires, Splurgoth, and other creatures like that. A human, even ones as horribly twisted as Charles Manson or Dennis Rader (the BTK Killer), do not qualify as 'supernatural' evil. Most of the creatures that would be under the umbrella of that label will be MDC beings that are inherently magical in some way.

EDIT
The Aishwarra, while it is a nasty predator, it is more a wild animal that is doing what it is supposed to; trying to survive. Like a shark that takes a swimmer down for lunch, it is simply trying to survive.

Does that help?

 

[Purr]

Silanon Take it from me. You are not stupid. =)

Sherwood It helps, but it doesn't quite answer my question. What is your definition of supernatural as it applies to your game?

The Aishwarra, while it is a nasty predator, it is more a wild animal that is doing what it is supposed to; trying to survive. Like a shark that takes a swimmer down for lunch, it is simply trying to survive.

This is an example of what the creature does, not what the creature is. You're talking about behavior; I am referring to the creatures unnatural unearthly abilities.

Behavior does not tell me if a creature the supernatural or not; Its abilities do. A ghost can be the nicest creature around and harm no one - that does not change the fact that the thing is supernatural.

An Aishwarra is evil. That's behavior-related. If it just ate meat or plants or hunted like any of the creature do on Earth, it would in my mind be a natural creature like the shark you used as an example.

This is not a shark. It is not a dinosaur or any other natural creature. It is a Mega-damage being. The Aishwarra eats magic. It hunts magical prey. The creature procreates by magic. These are not natural acts.

So you're saying in your game a Mega-damage creature that uses magic is not supernatural. Okay! Your game, your rules! I respect that.

So what is your definition of supernatural as it applies to your game?

 

[Sherwood]

Hmmm. I believe I understand what you are asking, and I will have to think on this and get back to you once I have a good answer.

 

[Sherwood]

Just so you know, I am not above admitting when I need to fix a problem. If it comes to a point that we can all establish that these Aishwarra's are in the supernatural evil category, I will go with that change whole-heartedly.

 

[Purr]

Just so you know, I am not above admitting when I need to fix a problem.

Bud, I've known that for decades. You've helped change my perspective in my games too. =)

By nailing down what your definition of supernatural is, it will lead to a lot less confusion in the future (at least for me). =)

I don't want our party to go on some big adventure against creatures that we are not prepared for because of a simple but important difference in word definitions.

Plus the very word "supernatural" is a big one. I think there are big reason why Palladium has those disclaimers in the beginnings of their books about their disbelief in the supernatural. The word alone carries a lot of weight.

And while I was reminded while studying U.S. gun law last night, "words matter!" =)

 

[Purr]

Sherwood What would Eron know about freeing potentially swallowed victims of the Aishwarra?

Sherwood Given what our characters rolled for lore prior to the fight (and preferably before anyone goes cutting into the thing), what do we know about the Aishwarra's digestive process? Sir Daggon was burying people; that implies corpses. So does the Aishwarra drain the victims and leave their bodies intact? If so, there is nothing physical in its stomach to retrieve; useful knowledge if it is true and our team is aware of it.

 

[Sherwood]

I have an IC post in the works that will address this.

 

[Purr]

Upcoming IC post! Woop-woop! 8D

 

[Purr]

From his previous knowledge in facing off against a Aishwarra, Eron knows that it is possible for a person to be swallowed whole and kept in a sort of stasis as its PPE is slowly drained from the poor victim, keeping the person nearby its many developing egg pouches under the rear thorax of the thing. That is the place to look first for anything still alive.

Directing your attention to the pouches, Terra can see that the Aishwarra was growing a clutch of eggs, but at this point they do not look to be very far along on their development and should not be able to hatch.

I see what Eron and Terra seem to know. But what of Snowfall? He rolled pretty well overall prior to the fight, if my memory serves? Does he recall any information of use here? To move without wisdom is... well... unwise! =)

 

[Sherwood]

I see what Eron and Terra seem to know. But what of Snowfall? He rolled pretty well overall prior to the fight, if my memory serves? Does he recall any information of use here? To move without wisdom is... well... unwise! =)

Yes, I'll say you would know about where a potential survivor of being swallowed whole would be located. You'll just have to get low enough to be able to spot the figure under the thorax of the critter.

 

[Purr]

Um... I'm asking if Snowfall knows enough about the Aishwarra to know if it's safe to remove the figure?

Because if it turns out that the figure is as screwed as a person post-Aliens-facehugger... I think there's really no reason to cut! Don't you? =)

What's in heeeeere? 80

 

[Purr]

Sherwood
Let me put it another way - has Snowfall ever seen or heard of someone being safely cut out of one of these monsters?