Fandom Life in a Quarantine Zone { The Last of Us 1x1 with icedthemoon }

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan chuckled looking at him and nodded with a grin. "I definitely get a lot of practice." He said, sending a wink to Carlos as he stepped closer, his lips pressing against Carlos' in an intense kiss again. He let it last for a moment before he pulled away with the grin still on his face.

Kaleb noticed that Asher still looked away, he could sense the man was ashamed. With his past that even Kaleb didn't know about. He placed a hand on Asher's cheek when he smiled at him. "Thank you. And so do you. I can sense you don't believe it, but I do and so does Jordan and even Carlos. I don't know what happened in your past, and I'd listen completely if you ever wanted to talk though." Kaleb told him.​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos was very much enjoying not being the one to control the moment. He spent so many years instigating and moving the moment along. He was the narrator of the story. But here with Jordan, he got to be a character instead of he was a player in Jordan’s game. And what a game this was. When Jordan pulled away, Carlos puffed out a laugh. “Asher must be pretty good at this too then?”

That was unexpected. Kaleb would want to listen to him talk about his past? Was that simply a courtesy since they knew Kaleb’s now? Asher let his head fall back onto the couch, staring at a ceiling that could not give him the answers. Was it worth sharing with someone entirely new? Someone similar but still so different? “I appreciate that,” he answered. “But I don’t think you would like me very much if I told you.” His eyes flicked to the door. “I don’t know why he does.”
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan looked at Carlos when he pulled away and chuckled at the laugh. "Asher.. is getting much better at it." He replied before he laughed as well. "Feel free to give him a try though, I think he's gotten better." Jordan added with a grin.

Kaleb listened intently, seeing his head falling back onto the couch. "It's true" Kaleb said at first, before he shook his head. "I wouldn't dislike you just because of your past, and sometimes sharing it makes it easier." Kaleb added as he looked at Asher when he talked about Jordan. "He likes you for you not your past. He's similar to Carlos, considering I'm the last person he should consider liking or even being with."​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos shook his head with a smile. “Mmm, I doubt he’s much my speed. Good guy probably, seems to need a lot of people around, but I don’t know if we’d do so great in that kind of situation.” He shrugged. “Kaleb is hard enough.” He sighed but smiled. “So maybe I’ll just stay here probably. Intrigued with the idea though.”

Asher considered that. He appreciated that. He was humbled and warmed by that. “I know. But it’s…” he frowned. “It’s hard.” He looked down at the lap he couldn’t so much see with Kaleb there. Maybe it was worth saying something. “I-“ Something important. “Um-“ something that he should know. “I. I killed a lot of people.” He let out a breath. “FEDRA, yes, but others too.” He placed a hand on his leg. “I don’t know how he or anyone else can forgive that. I can’t.”
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan nodded, completely understanding what Carlos was saying. "I get it. He's a good guy but he's definitely got some things we're still working on." Jordan replied before he tilted his head in curiosity. "Oh? What do you mean by Kaleb is hard enough?" He asked, curious.

Kaleb nodded, knowing that talking about your past is hard. He listened as Asher did talk a little about his past, and it didn't change how Kaleb saw him. It didn't change anything about his opinion of the man he was sitting on. Kaleb sighed softly, looking at Asher with his blue eyes. "I think he forgave you because he knows that you chose to leave. You chose to stop killing no matter how much you'd killed before. We all make mistakes, some mistakes a little more uh lethal than others but Jordan saw past that. He saw your heart, as I do. I forgive you as well. But we can all forgive you and it won't mean as much until you forgive yourself."​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos leaned back on the desk once again, hands propping him up. “Not to say that Kaleb is difficult or anything. Just that he’s got some baggage too. Like everyone.” Didn’t they all have something they were carrying around with them? That always made them them right? “Getting him to open up has taken all of my effort. But he’s worth the fight.”

Mistakes. Asher wished that he made some mistakes. He wished that he could look any of them in the face and say that he made one or two or some terrible mistakes. But he couldn’t. He made a lifetime full of them. And they weren’t just mistakes. They were cruel decisions. They were just as bad as the cruelty dealt to him, because he was angry. So angry. Being better now didn’t make him a better person. He was certain of it. But sometimes he could pretend. “Jordan is a romantic much like your Carlos. They are far more likely to see the good in someone than that someone deserves.” He placed his hand on Kaleb’s. “I have a feeling that’s you too. And I appreciate that. you are very kind.”
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan nodded in agreement. "I wasn't trying to imply that Kaleb was difficult but I also understand that he has baggage. He seemed like he had some things going on when we first met." Jordan said, remembering how the other man had been when they first met. "I know exactly what you mean with that though. It's taken a lot to get Asher to open and let go of his anger. But I also agree in that he's worth it."

Kaleb nodded as he listened. Carlos was definitely a romantic, and so was Jordan. It wasn't hard to tell that they were, even being overly flirty, it was obvious. Kaleb looked down at the hand over his and then up to Asher with a soft smile on his face. "Guilty as charged honestly. You're welcome. And I think that's enough serious talk for now. Should we carry on?"​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos laughed a little as he nodded. “It is nice to see that I am not the only one who chose someone a little more… averse to this lifestyle.” It really was refreshing to see someone else not only like him but also in a similar situation. It made him feel a little less like he might be a crazy person. Or maybe, he was still crazy, but he was not alone. Never once did he question if this was right. He knew it was. He knew this was where he was supposed to be. Sometimes, though, he questioned if he could do it. Of course he could. If Jordan could, so could he. He placed a hand on Jordan’s cheek and smiled. “You are a wonderful person to have around.” He kissed the other cheek before bouncing away.

Asher gripped that hand, a gesture he hoped he was doing right, and nodded. “What pray tell would you like to carry on? Would you like to find our men who are having their torrid affair? Because one never knows what Jordan could be up to.” He shrugged with a bit of a chuckle. “And yours is crazy. They sound like a terribly exciting pair.” He sighed. “Or would you like to do something else? Because I can’t say that I am very good at anything that isn’t being cryptic and misleading.” A self depreciating joke. He was so prone to those.
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan chuckled himself hearing that and nodded. "It seems to be the sort of people we attract" He replied. And he wasn't wrong, it seemed as though they did both find someone who needed them and their personalities. Jordan knew that Asher needed him, knew it the moment he ran into him. Knew it when he helped Jordan get free from his old group. Jordan smiled at the hand on his cheek and looked at Carlos. "I completely agree." He said, before his other cheek was kissed and then Carlos bounced away. Jordan laughed and followed after him.

Kaleb felt the grip on his hand and smiled at it. "Uh.. maybe not find out what they're doing. Carlos would feed into whatever Jordan does so I can only imagine what those two are up too." Kaleb said, a flush on his face. "I was thinking we had rooms to search, places to go, and eventually find somewhere to rest. I need to get this leg to heal." Kaleb said with a sigh before he listened to Asher. "I feel like there are in fact things you are good at that aren't cryptic and misleading."​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos, who was trying to make his escape before Jordan said or did anything, found himself laughing hysterically at his response. “How very humble of you, my fiery friend.” He swiveled around and tossed that red hair of his. It was so fun to play with. His own hair was equally voluminous but nearly as fun a color. His fingers ran through the strands of red, drawing his attention completely to that. Fingers from one hand. And then both. So soft. So easily manipulatable.

Asher slapped a hand down beside them with an affirmative nod. “You’re right. I am also very good at getting people to other places.” He stood, carefully taking Kaleb with him. “If I can get Jordan out of Pittsburgh, I can get you to the next rooms so that we can actually do real things. Unlike certain distracted individuals.” He slipped his arm around Kaleb’s shoulders, unsure what he needed to do to best help Kaleb. He was not exactly known for his assistance.
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan chuckled as he heard Carlos comment on his red hair. He couldn't help the smile that crossed his face as he felt Carlos' fingers run through his hair. "I'm very humble." Jordan commented, feeling now both hands running through his hair. That was something he loved anyone doing, running their fingers through his hair, playing with it, manipulating it. It was his biggest weakness though only a handful of people actually knew that.

Kaleb jumped a little from the slapped hand beside them and then he was picked up as Asher stood up. "Oh are you now?" Kaleb finally spoke as he listened. "Yes, take me to rooms so we can search and do something productive." Kaleb agreed, standing up and putting his own arm around Asher's shoulders. "You get to be my walking stick with my arm around your shoulders, just don't walk too fast, I can't put a lot of weight on this leg yet."​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos pulled the hair gently in one direction and then another. He did not get to do this with too many people, and he relished at the chance. For a moment, he just stood there, twirling the hair in various ways around his fingers. Hmm. He reached up and grabbed the tie from his own hair and yanked it out, his one longer locks falling around his face. Then he reached up and tied back Jordan’s as he would his own. Not quite the same but still interesting. “Ah, now you’re perfect, Red.”

Asher eyed Kaleb as he readjusted to be the way Kaleb needed him to be. “Walking stick. Got it. I think I can handle that. Probably.” What was the worst that could happen? It go horribly wrong and he has to carry him to a safe spot. Yeah, that was probably fine. This wasn’t the first time he dealt with an injured comrade. With his history, he had done that a good number of times. “Let's go through here and to that hallway. I’m sure it will lead us to somewhere productive.”
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan hummed softly as he allowed Carlos to gently play with his hair. He watched as Carlos grabbed the tie from his hair and watched as the other man's hair fell around his face. Hmm. Jordan's own fingers twitched wanting to feel Carlos' hair in his fingers. He felt the tie in his own hair and was curious as to how it looked when he heard Carlos. "I'm perfect? In your eyes that's a compliment."

Kaleb looked at Asher with a smile, seeing him readjust as he nodded. "You got it." He replied, keeping his arm on Asher's shoulders to steady himself. He would walk when Asher would, nodding at the idea. "I think that's a good idea, checking out the hallway through here, I'm sure we'll find supplies and maybe a place to rest for the night."​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos pulled his hands back to himself as he examined. “I mean, you’re as close to perfect as you can be when you aren’t me, of course,” he teased and his fingers ran through his own hair. He ruffled through it, feeling the change in weight as it had been a while since his hair was down. He missed it falling around him. He shook it lightly with a grin. Then he reached up and plucked the hair tie out. “Never mind, I like it better without.”

Asher did as they decided, moving them out of the room and to the hallway. “You guys looking for anything specific? I hate to pass over something i don’t need when I can get it to you instead.” As they moved into the hallway, they learned very quickly it was filled with junk piled everywhere. Whatever happened here years ago was not pretty. It almost felt like some group used it once for storage or something.
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan rolled his eyes with a chuckle, hearing him. "I'll take that compliment then." He said with a smile on his face as he watched Carlos run his hand through his hair. Jordan's eyes were focused as he watched him, his hand reaching out and running through Carlos' hair after he'd shaken it out. It was almost like he was hypnotized and had to touch it. "I like yours better without the tie too."

Kaleb looked at Asher and shook his head. "Not really, though Carlos is a fan of explosions so I keep an eye out for things to make bombs, and I use my pistol so I'm always looking for stuff to make silencers." Kaleb said as they moved into the hallway. He looked around at the junk piled everywhere and Kaleb could see that it was almost like this was used for storage. "It doesn't seem like there's much here. Maybe we should try the next floor up?"​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos watched Jordan like he was in a trance. How intriguing. Was this something that Jordan liked? Interesting. He raised his hands to cover Jordan’s before trailing down his arms. He shook his head just enough to move the strands of his hair around Jordan's hands. “I can see that. I guess I’ll just have to let it stay down then. For a little while.”

Asher nodded. “Explosions. Like all the infected in the street. Right. I can look for that. Though, silencers are far more useful honestly.” He smirked towards Kaleb. “Much better idea.” He too searched through, though there wasn’t a whole lot for them. He pocketed a few things just in case someone might need them. He agreed. “Yeah, I think another floor is the best idea." He led them towards the stairwell. He hoped it was not blocked or anything.
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan was very much in a small trance, feeling the hands on his before they trailed down his arms. His eyes were glued as the other man's head shook enough so that the strands of hair shifted around Jordan's hands. His fingers twirled through the strands, barely registering that Carlos said anything at all. The way his hair moved through Jordan's fingers was fascinating. Asher's hair was wonderful, but it wasn't long like this and moved through and around his fingers the way Carlos' did.

Kaleb saw the smirk and nodded. "I'm more of a silent shooter than Carlos who insists that exploding infected is like an art form." Kaleb said as they looked around, and then headed for the stairwell. Kaleb didn't know how he was going to get up to the next floor, but as he pulled open the door, he saw that the stairs up were clear and not blocked. That's good he figured.​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos was absolutely fascinated with the way Jordan seemed enthralled with his hair. He knew it was great. It had the best texture for sure. “It’s better when it’s washed,” he commented as he let Jordan explore the strands. “It curls and bounces in the most fun of ways. It’s a shame you can’t play with it then.” That was one of the worst parts of traveling instead of staying in the Zone. He missed baths. He was going to have to find a way to keep himself at least a little clean if for no other reason than to keep his hair appropriately fun to play with.

Asher let out a small laugh. “Yeah, I can see how he might be like that. But I think you’ve got it right.” He examined this man he only met recently. This man who was opposite to what he thought someone he should hate should be but also carrying much of that with him. The good parts like the practicality and the sensible choices. Asher was absolutely fascinated. He turned his attention to the stairs and for a moment he considered this. He considered it because there were a couple of options, and he kind of wanted to go with the Carlos way as weird as that was. It was practical, right? He could pretend. “I believe this is the part where I offer you a ride.” He was not quite like the other two. So instead, he paused at the stairs and moved slightly away in a mild bow.
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan was broken from his little trance when he heard Carlos' voice. "Perhaps we can find a working source of water. I'd love to play with your hair when it's clean." Jordan's voice was soft, looking at the strands of hair once most time before he dropped his hands to his sides. This was going to be a lot of fun traveling with these two.

Kaleb chuckled, hearing Asher's laugh. "Oh do I now? A fan of the silent shooter." Kaleb teased as he looked at the man in front of him. A hunter that killed off several of his fellow officers, ones that Kaleb had never met. It didn't matter, what was done is done, the past is over and this was the now. His eyebrow arched as he saw Asher give him a mild bow after hearing him. "I'll take you up on that ride."​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos almost sighed when Jordan’s hands dropped from his hair. He kind of liked that. It wasn’t often that he got that kind of attention. He reached his own hand up and slowly crept his fingers from the side and inward until he was firmly engrossed. Covered. He squeezed a little more than gently, and grinned. “Oh I’m sure we can find a body of water. You stick with me, and you’ll get to do all you want with that.” He tugged at the grasp he held before letting it go and beginning to walk away. He wasn’t sure where he was going, but he did love to be a tease.

Asher’s cheeks brightened just a little as Kaleb called him on his obvious preference. “What can I say? I like precision.” Which was more than true. He never let himself get close to anyone in really any form prior to Jordan, but since getting to know him and opening himself up very slowly, there were a couple of things he learned. Someone who could silently take out the enemy was one of those kinds of people that he was naturally drawn to. Quick and efficient. So the fact that Kaleb was also that kind of person made him feel a little uneasy. He would not understand what that meant on his own. With Kaleb’s permission, he swept Kaleb off his feet and grinned. “You know, this isn’t so bad.” He began to make his way up the stairs quicker than Carlos but also a lot more agile than Carlos ever was. Carlos was big and boisterous. Asher, though also strong, mastered the craft of using his body as a tool to help with leverage and movement. That was why he could take even a big guy like Carlos down. It was also why he could move someone like Kaleb with relative ease. That and he kind of liked it. Being close to this guy they only just met. He wondered if this was how Jordan was with Carlos.
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan wasn't expecting for Carlos to put his hand in Jordan's hair, fully, completely. The squeeze in his hair and grin made Jordan grin back. "I can't wait until we can find some water." He replied, before he arched an eyebrow. "Is that so?" Jordan added, feeling the tug and then Carlos began to walk away. Jordan chuckled and immediately followed him, racing to catch up beside him. "You are quite the tease, how does Kaleb put up with you?"

Kaleb chuckled a little at the comment before he nodded. "Me too, though I found the person with the least amount of precision." He said with a smile. he was about to say something else when he was swept off his feet and into Asher's arms. "It really isn't. Has Jordan every carried you?" Kaleb asked as they made their way up the stairs. He was fascinated that even though Asher wasn't as big as Carlos, he was still very strong and knew how to use his body. It was fascinating spending time in someone else's arms, someone other than Carlos.​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Carlos laughed as he sauntered himself away, swinging his arms until he heard Jordan catch up, and in one fluid motion, swung a hand back to capture Jordan’s. “Oh, he doesn’t. Do you think I can get away with things like this with him?” He thought about it, and though he was thinking that the answer was no, that was prior to when Kaleb felt more comfortable with… well, everything. And now he was off cavorting with someone who was about two seconds from decking him right there. Huh, how things did change. Did that mean he could be more forward than he was being before?And he was being awfully forward prior to this as well. “And even if I did, you are just too playful to resist.” He bit his bottom lip as he winked.

“You mean other than that fascinating display of affection earlier when he decided he too wanted the stair toll?” Asher laughed and attempted a shrug which went less well than he hoped due to the holding of another person. “Honestly, I am a bit… rigid. So he has not been able to do nearly as much as I am sure he would like. But…” He let the smile he learned to have since meeting Jordan capture his body. “I let him do some things sometimes. When I am in the right mood.” An image of Jordan just being unabashedly Jordan crossed his mind, and he let himself soften. He was almost relaxed back to where he was before learning about Kaleb’s past. Almost. “But I am always worried that I can’t give him what he needs, you know?” A confession he was not expecting for himself to say out loud. Maybe he was more comfortable than he thought. They reached the top of the stairs and he paused, again unsure what to do. Jordan and Carlos made this look so easy.
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan chuckled at the hand that captured his, watching Carlos in front of him. He listened to the other man for a moment, and he thought about it. "Maybe he'll put up with more now, then again. He's hanging with Asher." Jordan chuckled, then he saw the wink and smiled, sending a wink back to him.

Kaleb listened to Asher and chuckled at that, though he tilted his head to the side as well. "Is that why you pushed him to Carlos?" Kaleb asked after listening completely. "I also understand what you mean. Carlos is so different from me, so out there with everyone and everything. I never had anyone like him in my life before I met him. I sometimes wonder if he'd do better with someone that didn't have the trauma I had brought with us." He said as they reached the top of the stairs. "You can set me down, and if you'd like a toll like the other two, I might be able to handle that."​

 

[icedthemoon]

Carlos Da Silva and Asher McCoy
Aspiring Artist, Former Hunter | 23, 30 | Current location ;; New Mexico

With the hand he captured, Carlos twirled around, spinning himself closer to Jordan until he was up against his chest. “Mmhmm. Maybe. Maybe they can learn from each other.” He reached up a hand and wove his fingers in the hair that flopped so intriguingly up there. He tilted his head up and back as he stayed in that moment, close. This was a good moment. A nice change. A good ‘and’ to make the ‘or’ worth more later.

Asher paused at the question. Was that what he did? Was that why he pushed Jordan to Carlos? That certainly did make sense. “Well, I guess it’s a little bit of that. He deserves to have someone who can give him what he desires. I can’t be fun and spontaneous like that. But I like that he is. I, uh,” he laughed at the thought before continuing. “I like who he gets to be when he has someone around to be like that with. It’s so much better when someone can reciprocate the way he wants.” He gently put Kaleb down now that he had someone to tell him that it was okay. He hated that he was so awkward. “And I like who I am when I’m with him. It lets me do things like this.” He smiled at Kaleb for just a moment before he captured his face in his hands and kissing him. It was nowhere near like anything Jordan or Carlos could do, but it was still more passionate that Asher could have done even a year ago. And he was finding that he didn’t hate being around someone like Kaleb. Actually he kind of really liked it. He didn’t know what that meant since he briefly hated him or at least the background he came from. It was a lot of confusing all at once. When he pulled away, he almost smiled.
​

 

[EquineGurl23]

Kaleb Price and Jordan DeShay
Former FEDRA officer, Former Smuggler | 25, 28 | Current location ;; New Mexico

Jordan blinked, not expecting Carlos to twirl around and spin closer to Jordan, though he probably should've. "I think they could learn a lot from each other, much like I'm sure we could learn a lot from each other as well." He said, feeling those fingers weaving into his hair. Jordan's eyes looked at Carlos before he shifted so he could lean in and kiss him all well those fingers stayed in his hair. He loved Asher, loved him more than anyone, but there was something addictive about kissing someone who gave just as much back as Jordan gave.

Kaleb nodded, listening to Asher. "I think it's a mixture for someone like him. He desires people, but you'll be his number one person." Kaleb said, before he chuckled and nodded. "I've never seen Carlos with someone just as intense before, but I see what you mean by that. It's intriguing and interesting to watch them together." Kaleb agreed, and then he tilted his head for a moment before his eyes widened feeling hands on his face and then he was kissed. Kaleb's eyes closed a moment later and he found himself kissing back. It wasn't like Carlos' kisses, but it was still very passionate. He opened his eyes when Asher pulled away and he looked closely to see the faintest of possible smiles. It made Kaleb smile just a little more. "That was a pretty good kiss, especially considering the only other one I'd had was with Carlos."​