Making a race that doesn't have hands.

I am currently in the process of creating a D&D like fantasy world. It has most of the basic races like elves and what not, but I'm also taking a few creatures from traditional folklore and am tailoring them to suit my needs.


One of these creatures is the Coatl, the Feather-Snake. After the Aztec god, Quetzalcoatl. They're actualy featured in the D&D Monster Manual as gigantic snakes with feathered wings, but in my world, they're a bit different.


For one: they're a lot smaller. The average coatl is about 6 ft long from head to tail and, standing up comfortably, about 3 ft. Second: they are more neutral than lawful. Personality wise, Coatl are like winged dolphins, carefree and playful (except with all the laziness and vanity of a cat). And third: there are LOTS of them. They hang out in flocks, and where they live, they interact with other races on a daily basis.


That's where we have a problem. How can a race that doesn't have hands be a part of society? How can they earn a living? I mean, they don't HAVE to. They could just sit around, gossiping like birds on a telephone wire and dispensing useless commentary to passerby's. Hunt when they get hungry. But humanoids can provide coatl with certain luxuries that they can't provide themselves, like cooked food and comfortable housing. All they need is a way to EARN some cash and then a way to TRANSPORT it.


Earning money is simple enough. While coatl cannot easily hold tools and lack the strength for manual labor, they do have a voice and could make a living as storytellers, heralds, advisers, messengers and criers (which is like a news reporter/advertiser, except he stands on a box in the middle of town and shouts it out at the top of lungs). It also stands to reason that- if they're like birds- they would have a beautiful singing voice so we can add Bard to that list. If you're a shopkeeper at the market and you need to attract some business, all you need to do is find some coatl who's loafing around, offer him a silver piece, and BAM! You have a bright, colorful, feather duster sitting on your tent spewing propaganda for you (but you better not piss him off or he might KILL your business out of spite).


As far as CARRYING currency, well, actually a coatl would not need to get paid in the first place. After all, beggars and bards would strategically get themselves invited to parties and then eat off the banquet table in leu of payment. Still, there is this one, itty-bitty, teeny-tiny thing...


COATL LOVE SHINIES!!!


Even if a Coatl didn't need money, they would probably still COLLECT the coins. They might decorate their nest with it or trade it amongst themselves like Pokemon cards. Anyway, if a coatl wanted to carry more coins than he could fit in his mouth, all he'd have to do is have a humanoid punch a hole in them and string em' on a necklace. From there, the coatl could- with a little practice- put it on himself by grabbing the necklace in his mouth, tossing it into the air, and letting it land around his neck. Although, if they have feathers all along their body (haven't decided), taking it OFF might be tricky.


Any thoughts?

MrMopp said:

That's where we have a problem. How can a race that doesn't have hands be a part of society? How can they earn a living? ...
Any thoughts?

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Yeah, I've got some. You've already given them the will to trade, and where there's a will there's a way. The first thing that I would suggest is to give them a prehensile tail, one capable of fine motor skills. A tail with that level of control could substitute for a human hand for most tasks. Need to lift a candle? Tail. Want to pick a merchant's pocket? Tail. How about scribbling your signature across a contract. Tail. You get the idea.


What about professions; what practical role could intelligent winged snakes fulfill? I would have to imagine they would make exceptional messengers (no horse required = cheaper overhead). Flying snakes should be fantastic predators, so maybe they could harvest and sell hard to come by game animals. Things like quail, pheasant, dove, hares, and mink.


I like the idea of one that's a florist. A serpent that flies over thick tree canopies in order to bring back flowers that are too tricky for humanoids to collect. And then the snake would spend its afternoons creating one of a kind wreaths and arrangements for enthusiastic (vain) home & shop decorators. Ideas like that are endless.


How would they carry their money/goods? I'm sure humanoid tailors would be happy to construct custom coin purses — something that rests tightly under a wing. The teeth or the tail could open the purse's drawstring in order to fetch its contents. That's one way, but I prefer another.


Years ago I watched a daytime talk show where a man had developed the skill to swallow objects and then regurgitate them at will. Coins were swallowed and then spit back up. A goldfish went down alive and then it was coughed up with no visible damage. The guy even swallowed a fragile lightbulb and then regurgitated it... If it were up to me, that's where I would go with the snakes. They would have a second stomach, a storage gut, an organ that could be called on to cough up specific pieces of inventory. Is that gross? You bet, but it's perfect for fantasy imo.

Is this going to work with D&D, or merely be D&D styled? Either way...


Coatl sorcerors and wizards for hire. Give the race, hrm, I think it's Prestidigitation? The cantrip that allows for small feats of sleight-of-hand and telekinesis?


Don't make D&D's mistake and treat the magic or other system elements as utterly separate to the world.


Bone is on the right track, too - in particular, many avians tend to have a pouch in the throat where they can hold stones to aid in their digestion. Coatl having such a thing for coins and small items really isn't a stretch. Prehensile tale makes perfect sense for a snake-bird, too.

Grey said:

many avians tend to have a pouch in the throat where they can hold stones to aid in their digestion.

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Huh. I didn't know that.

Well, if you don't have teeth, how are you supposed to masticate seeds and stolen corn?


I believe some reptiles have 'em too. I could look it up but I don't feel terribly pushed this second.

I'll do some research too. So far I'v found out that a pigeons digestive track involves a crop, a stomach, and a gizzard, but I don't what the difference is yet.

Did you find any of our ideas helpful?

I did actualy. Thank you guys. I was initially worried about the prehensile tail thing because they would have to have tail feathers in order to fly and those don't bend. But I occurred to me that the tail feathers dont need to be right at the end of their tail. The last half a foot could be left bare.


Reargitatuon is gross. But it is the most practical way to tansport small items. And I suppose if you live around coatls you'd get used to it.


 
@Grey As far as magic goes, it's not quite like D&D. In all the really good fantasy story's- like Lord of the Rings or The Chronicles of Narnia- magic is a subtle part of the world. Almost undetectable. Very rarely is there any flashiness. In this role play (probably diceless) I'm going to allow for a little flash because no one would want to play if I didn't, but I'm going to put some heavy restrictions on it.


For one: wizards would have to be off-limits to players. How the heck would you regulate them and diceless role play?


For another: if your character has magic in their blood, it has to be limited to one or two kinds of form, like fire, water or illusions. You might be able to twist your magic to accomplish a different effect (like, for a Pyro-mage, making a wall out fire or creating tangible objects out of smoke). but the more dramatic the effect and the fewer steps taken to reach that point, the more energy it takes to do so.


Clerics would also be allowed. I still need to figure out how to handle that. Being a religious person myself, this could be tricky


Anyway, I think it makes sense that the coatl have some kind of magic about them. Maybe, as a group, they can do stuff like Weather Control. But I got to say, the thought of coatl moving stuff with his mind is kind of creepy (there are different kinds of coatl, and a few of them are evil). I'll do a little research on Aztec mythology but MAN, that's messed up stuff! The Aztecs weren't exactly very nice people.

Thinking about physiology, I'm wondering just how bird-like I should make the Coatl. There's no question in my mind that while snakes are beautiful, they're also creepy and shallow and that birdlike qualities would make them far more charming (not to mention cute and cuddly. Nobody wants to cuddle a snake). But there are a few avian aspect just don't go well on a serpentine body. Feathers, for instance, while pretty and exotic- never mind the fact that it's called a "feather serpent" for a reason- would make gripping and land locomotion tricky. The scales of a snakes underbelly are actually designed to dig into the ground like grooves on a tire but feathers are too slick and flimsy to get good friction. Plus if a coatl was crawling around in the tree branches and they did too tight of a bend, their feathers would get stuck if they try to back up.


Easy enough to solve I guess, just give them scales on their belly and short, slightly inward-curving feathers on their back. But What I'm REALLY having trouble deciding on is their FACE. Do I give them a beak like a bird or a snout like a snake?


What Ive figured about how a Coatls mouth works is this: Coatls are omnivorous. A large part of their diet comes from fruit that grows on the trees they live it. For anything larger than a grape, probably need a way to puncture the flesh (and if nuts are on the menu, they definitely do). For protein, Coatls prey on small animals. Mostly, it's small birds that they snatch out of the branches. Its more convenient and being on the ground leave them vulnerable to predators (yes, they have those). But a few quite like the taste of rodent and often make for skilled ratters (thank you for the inspiration, @Bone2pick ). Once captured, a Coatl could kill it by constricting it, throttling it, or if they have sharp beaks, tearing out its throat. The last two are quicker so that's probably more likely.


I suppose it's not impossible for a Coatl to jump something the size of a raccoon and strangle it like an anaconda. (might break a wing doing it but MAN! talk about macho!). But once again they would need a way to tear the flesh apart because unlike their reptilian cousins, they do NOT swallow prey that large in one gulp. CAN not. They wouldn't be able to fly afterwards. Besides, it's gross.


Physically, A bird beak seems like the rational choice. The reason why I'm hesitant is because beaks make facial expressions. Not that a snakes snout could do that very well either, (maybe rage) but at least it's easier to pretend that its capable of showing emotions the way human does. Plus, I was tinkering around with the idea of a venomous kind of Coatl. How do you put snake fangs beak?


Any thoughts?


(I'm not taking your time am I?)

I'm afraid you'll have to accept human modes of expression fall flat once you put this much genuine effort and creativity into your fantasy races,


Maybe give Coatl very expressive eyes, wing gestures, head-poses, and make tone of voice an important part of their social interaction?


The scale/feather solution is pretty elegant, and this is a fantasy setting so don't hesitate to hyperextend certain physiological facts.


Venomous Coatl could be a subspecies with more reptilian faces? Or maybe Coatl saliva is venomous, but Coatl themselves are immune? Perhaps there's a kind of Coatl with venomous spurs on their wingbones, like a platypus?

A race without hands? Perhaps your Coatl people can be like an armless biped type. Whether using their jaws as the hands or even telekinesis as a substitute, the possibilities are endless. Dinosaurs without significant arms made it up with powerful jaws. I presume the avian and reptilian path would be like that as the dinosaurs are indeed the missing link between birds and reptiles. So yes, I would think of looking to the dinosaurs as potential inspirations.

Grey said:

I'm afraid you'll have to accept human modes of expression fall flat once you put this much genuine effort and creativity into your fantasy races,
Maybe give Coatl very expressive eyes, wing gestures, head-poses, and make tone of voice an important part of their social interaction?

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... I'm an idiot.


This is what happens when I try to type tired and unmedicated. I get fussy. And sloppy apparently. Sorry about the sea of typos back there.

Naaah. I overlook stuff like that all the time, and I practically do this for a living.

Grey said:

Venomous Coatl could be a subspecies with more reptilian faces? Or maybe Coatl saliva is venomous, but Coatl themselves are immune? Perhaps there's a kind of Coatl with venomous spurs on their wingbones, like a platypus

Click to expand...

Oooooh! I like the venimous spur idea.


 
Actually they're all good ideas but I like that one the most


 

DerUbermensch said:

A race without hands? Perhaps your Coatl people can be like an armless biped type. Whether using their jaws as the hands or even telekinesis as a substitute, the possibilities are endless. Dinosaurs without significant arms made it up with powerful jaws. I presume the avian and reptilian path would be like that as the dinosaurs are indeed the missing link between birds and reptiles. So yes, I would think of looking to the dinosaurs as potential inspirations.

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I wasn't sure at first but think your right. I should look into dinosaurs. But I don't know about telekinesis. I actually want to discourage any kind "of cure" all magic.


Honestly, I don't know if anyone's going to want to play a coatl. But there still an importaint aspect of this world, and I think the more detail I put into every little thing, The more natural this world will seem to the players.


As you can tell, i've had a lot of fun with these guys

I can indeed tell. Though primarily, looking into the dinosaur world would actually be the best path that would suit your desires and tastes for the Coatl. Using their jaws as the hand substitute and their tongue can be long and prehensile too if needed. As I have said before, the possibilities are endless with the race.

@MrMopp IRL there are people who don't have arms and adapted from a young age to use their feet really skillfully. While your idea might be that these people don't have arms or any way to move things around like grabbing them with toes they'd still be able to use their legs to make up some uses of arms.


Maybe they can be really smart too and know how to con and be merchants, so other people can be paid to attend to them and put on their clothes for them.

Well the original idea was that they didn't need of want to wear clothes, never mind the logistical problems involved. (imagine, an entire race doomed to never wear pants. It's tragic( )). But now I'm imagining a smug Coatl standing in front of a tailor shop mirror, admiring his specially designed shirt, saying to the tailor, "This is a day to remember, Jim. The day we Coatl finally joined the ranks of the clothes-wearing races. See if the don't take us seriously NOW."


Meanwhile the tailor is doing his best not to snicker.

Depending on the moral tone of your setting, perhaps the Coatl have even harnessed a coexistent species as a servitor class.

LOL. Cats have those. They're called humans.


 
I actually like the conning idea, but the problem is that they would have to smarter than ME. How do you play an NPC that's smarter than you?

So, a while ago I was imagining a few combinations of snakes, birds, and aztec gods I could use to make different spiecies of Coatls. Not all of them are fully formed ideas, but so far I've got:


Jungle Coatl


•most well known


•cross between snake and parrot


•live in tropical rainforest


•have beaks


•have feathers all over


•two sets of tail feathers: big ones near the end tail, and a little fan at the tip (this arrangement gives a Coatl good mobility in air without compromising the dexterity of their tail for other uses).


•friendly, social, (yet selfish) and love interacting with other sentients


•opportunistic omnivores


•warm blooded


•have slight connection to wind magic


•associated god is Quetzalcoatl, god of wind


Swamp Coatl


•live in the Black Swamp (which is a horrible, nasty place filled with horrible, nasty monsters and horrible, nasty plant life. Things that live there long enough start to take on monstrous features, which is exactly what happened to these guys.)


•cross Between viper and bat


•highly poisonous


•covered in black scales


•snake-like face with both serrated teeth and foldable, hypodermic fangs (they don't waste their poison on the small animals that they eat. They save it for large creatures that either threaten them or piss them off)


•Bat-like wings


•large, leathery tail fan that bends and has short claws at the tip


•Growchy, aggressive, and tend to bite people who annoy them


•good swimmers


•nocturnal


•mostly carnivorous


•cold blooded (?)


•Associate god is Xolotl, god of death ad sickness


Sea Coatl


•cross between snake and seagull


•Have beaks


•live by the ocean


•have slight water magic


•acociated god is Tlaloc, god of rain and water


•(least worked-on)


Grey Coatl:


•cross between snake and owl


•rare


•revered as shamans by other Coatl (and even by the bipedal races)


•have strong conection to magic involving spirits and divination.


•acociated god is Mictlantecuhtli, god of the underworld


And then, i was imaging what a cobra-Coatl would be like...


Subterranean Coatl


(aka Naga)


•cross between cobra and bird.


•live deeeeeeeep under ground in a vast cave network lit by glowing crystals and abundant with strange plants and animals.


•face like cobra with crystal embedded in forehead


•have snake scales


•have- get this- feathered wings that come in a variety of light, milky colors.


•have three, big tail feathers (like ostrich feathers) that can bend, curl, fold and harden unnaturally.


• all have serrated teeth, but strangely, only a few are venomous.


•feathers and forehead-crystal glow dimly at will.


•are natural- and might I add highly skilled- telekinetics (most can only move small objects, but a few could pick up a refrigerator and throw it)


•Unlike the other Coatl, naga are HIGHLY CIVILIZED.


•They make tools and weapons.


•They build house and city's


•They use currency.


•They have laws


•they have an Emperor


•they have public education (which even teaches basic wizardry)


•they have a formal cast system (priest, mage, warrior, worker, etc.)


I've been doing a lot of work on these guys lately. Partially because there sooooo alien and interesting to me, but mostly because they'd make a better playable race than the Coatl. I'd still leave the Coatl open, but honestly I always figured that they'd probably just be there for flavor and people would only use them for familiars or if they had a interesting sense of humor. The Naga on the other hand are not so animalistic and having telekinesis compensates for lack of hands quite nicely.


Then we get to a backstory problem. Why do the naga live underground? According to Indian mythology/religion ( i'm not sure which so if any of you happen to be Hindu PLEASE forgive me) the naga we're hiding from a demigod that they had angered. Perhaps in this case, they went underground thousands of years ago to escape some great cataclysm and didn't realize that the danger has passed. Seems a little contrived. If we were going to do it that way, any Naga characters would have to be explores or really, really lost. A simpler solution would be to say that sun light burns their skin, but would make them difficult to play in any outdoor environment. Maybe they just don't like being outside. I don't know, what do you guys think?