Need help making a plot! Need some ideas! :>

[Daisie]

<p>


Hiya! So I have a very basic idea for a plot for a RP with a couple of people, and all I need is some help expanding on that idea. If you have any ideas, feel free to post them below and we can discuss or something. <img alt=" " data-emoticon="" height="20" src="<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/smile.png" srcset="<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/smile@2x.png 2x" title=" " width="20" /> So, my idea is that our main group of 1-5 people are living in a farm-type household, and they're all pretty much roomates and friends working together to keep the farm moving. This household is out in a field, which is next to a forest, and nearby a mountain range. There is very large lake within that forest that eventually leads out to an ocean. Also a while away is a little town whose name I haven't decided yet. So these guys are working together to keep this farm running. But over at the town, there have been strange attacks by huge winged dragons. Nobody knows where they've come from, and why they're attacking, but they've been causing a substantial amount of damage. Luckily for our characters, they're far enough away from the town that they don't have to worry for the moment. And lately, the animals have been acting strange, out of control, and in an all-out bad mood. After some exploration in the mountains, they find a temple of some sort. It looks like it had been there for ages upon ages, with cracked stone and moss galore. Inside this shrine, they find a tall and robed man with a hood concealing his face. He casts some sort of dark spell on a bright light, sitting atop a pedestal. While he is doing this, the man spots our group and halts his spell. He summons some dragons into the room to hunt them down, and flees the scene before he can finish what he was doing before. Our group, of course, flees the scene as well, being chased down by the dragons. They retreat back to the farm to talk a bit and speculate. They decide that it is best to hunt down this man, as the attacks at the village may have been his fault, seeing that he could summon dragons. In the morning, they pack up and head out again to the shrine atop the mountain, hidden in some sort of cave. They see the light on the pedestal again, with no dark crystal barrier around it. Eventually one of them gets carried away, touching the bright light, and it suddenly forms into a large creature. A glowing white creature in the shape of a bear. It speaks to them. It turns out, this bear is the Spirit of the Mountains, keeping order across all of the terrain and the animals. It explains that the man they saw before was a Dark Sorcerer, who had sealed all of the rest of the Spirits away. The Spirit of the Forest (A deer) , the Spirit of the Ocean (A manta ray), the Spirit of the Air (A barn owl), and the Spirit of the Fields (A horse). They didn't realize what was happening until it was too late, and by the time they did realize, they had lost so much power that they couldn't do anything about it. Therefore, the animals they care for had lost their spark of happiness, and logical thinking. The Spirit of the Mountains also tells them that, to set the other Spirits free, they'll need help. They'll need to gain the trust and friendship of the animal they represent, because the bond between the Spirit and the animal they represent is stronger than normal. Strong enough to break them free from their prison, that sucks so much power from them. After they finish talking, the Dark Sorcerer walks in on them, backed up with dragons and a skeleton army. Literally. Made of darkness and bones. Our group is driven back to their farm once more, but this time the Dark Sorcerer follows them. In their own house, the Sorcerer decides that they can't have them getting in the way, or telling anyone their plans. So they use the power they had gained from the Spirits to turn our group into animals. And worst of all, they aren't just turned into any animals. They're all turned into chickens. After that, the Sorcerer and his minions leave back to the mountains, to go seal the Spirit of the Mountains in a crystal prison, to gain power from it. So now our group has to find the Shrine of the Field Spirit, and find out what the Spirit represents before trying to befriend that animal. In this case, a Horse. So what do you guys think? Feel free to spew your ideas in the comments. I'm thinking that after they set the Spirit of the Fields free, they can be turned into another animal by the spirit to make it easier. It's supposed to be a story about what you would do if you were an animal, and of all kinds. I'm planning on switching them from chickens to maybe horses, to maybe goats or sheep to fish or dolphins to birds of some sort.. And I'm also thinking that somewhere near the end, they'll be turned into dragons. The dragons belong to the Spirit of the Air, and the reason they're attacking the town is because they're frustrated because they're under control of the Sorcerer. The Dark Sorcerer, who doesn't want to deal with rambunctious dragons, lets them go to attack the town. And the only reason that the Dragons actually attack the town out of frustration is because the Spirit of the Air isn't there to give them logic. So without the Spirits, the animals lose most of their self-control and patience. So whaddaya think, dudes? I want the Sorcerer to have some sort of depth other than just being a power-hungry megalomaniac. And I would also like to know more about the society of animals. I know how farm animals and birds interact with one another. But I don't know what the society of bears or deer or orcas interact. If any of you have special knowledge in that area, give me some tips!


</p>

 

[Life.]

Mmmm interesting idea. I kind of gave a small chuckle when I saw they were turned into chickens. By having the characters be continuously changed into animals I assume you're having the characters keep their human sense and logic intact but just a different body? And did you already have a motive in mind for the Dark Sorcerer?

 

[Daisie]

Mmmm interesting idea. I kind of gave a small chuckle when I saw they were turned into chickens. By having the characters be continuously changed into animals I assume you're having the characters keep their human sense and logic intact but just a different body? And did you already have a motive in mind for the Dark Sorcerer?

Yep, they're going to be turned into roosters and hens, with the same human sense and logic. They'll be able to communicate with the other chickens, but not any other race. And luckily, I know everything about how the pecking order of a chicken coop works, as I'm at one every day. It's quite interesting, actually.


And no, I don't have any motive for the Dark Sorcerer's actions, other than him just being a megalomaniac. Maybe you can help with that? ^w^

 

[NemoTheSurvivor]

So, average farm hands know that dragon attacks are incredibly common, yet decide to venture away from the farm (where they have been relatively safe), through a forest, up a mountain, and into a cave with no real reason other than plot (not to mention finding the time to travel through a forest and climb a mountain, only having to do it again on the way back, while still being able to do all of the chores required for running a farm). Then the farmhands outrun angry dragons, only repeat all of this again the next day? And all of this is just the introduction of the roleplay?

 

[Grey]

Before I start giving specific feedback, I suggest you find time to skim these.


Roleplay - Basic Plotting


Roleplay - Primordial - A World-Building Primer


Roleplay - Playing God - A GM Tutorial


Roleplay - So You Want To Write...


So, some specific questions.

There is very large lake within that forest that eventually leads out to an ocean.

Minor thing, but if I remember rightly, this is called a sound.

After some exploration in the mountains

Why are they exploring the mountains when a nearby town is being attacked and they have a farm to manage?

flees the scene as well, being chased down by the dragons.

How are they meant to escape from dragons? I don't know what version of dragons you're using but since they can fly, traditionally breathe fire, and have large natural weapons, one would assume running back to a farmhouse is merely a stay of execution.

hey decide that it is best to hunt down this man

He can summon dragons. How are a pack of farmers meant to stop them? Why do they not seek out the nearest authority for help? Does the town have no functional militia? In fact, what's the cultural context - is this a feudal society where the most advanced weapons are siege weapons, and the nearest lord is really screwing up by not dispatching knights to deal with the dragons?

Eventually one of them gets carried away, touching the bright light

How do you guarantee that a simple farmer will take that risk?

So they use the power they had gained from the Spirits to turn our group into animals.

Why not just kill them?

But I don't know what the society of bears or deer or orcas interact. If any of you have special knowledge in that area, give me some tips!

Depends on the species of bear or deer. Most bears are solitary animals, with exceptions for mating and raising cubs. Deer normally live in herds of many does and their fawns, with a single adult buck who defends their territory and mates with the does. I believe young bucks that can't defeat the dominant male form small herds of their own which wander in search of vulnerable males to usurp, but I can't recall.


Orcas are really social - they tend to form maternal family groups, with pods being comprised of a few such groups. What's really fascinating is that orcas can be divided into clans based on shared 'songs'.

 

[Daisie]

Before I start giving specific feedback, I suggest you find time to skim these.
Roleplay - Basic Plotting


Roleplay - Primordial - A World-Building Primer


Roleplay - Playing God - A GM Tutorial


Roleplay - So You Want To Write...


So, some specific questions.


Minor thing, but if I remember rightly, this is called a sound.


Why are they exploring the mountains when a nearby town is being attacked and they have a farm to manage?


How are they meant to escape from dragons? I don't know what version of dragons you're using but since they can fly, traditionally breathe fire, and have large natural weapons, one would assume running back to a farmhouse is merely a stay of execution.


He can summon dragons. How are a pack of farmers meant to stop them? Why do they not seek out the nearest authority for help? Does the town have no functional militia? In fact, what's the cultural context - is this a feudal society where the most advanced weapons are siege weapons, and the nearest lord is really screwing up by not dispatching knights to deal with the dragons?


How do you guarantee that a simple farmer will take that risk?


Why not just kill them?


Depends on the species of bear or deer. Most bears are solitary animals, with exceptions for mating and raising cubs. Deer normally live in herds of many does and their fawns, with a single adult buck who defends their territory and mates with the does. I believe young bucks that can't defeat the dominant male form small herds of their own which wander in search of vulnerable males to usurp, but I can't recall.


Orcas are really social - they tend to form maternal family groups, with pods being comprised of a few such groups. What's really fascinating is that orcas can be divided into clans based on shared 'songs'.

Okay, okay, okay jeez calm down I get the idea. It's a stupid plot.


@NemoTheSurvivor @Grey

 

[Grey]

That is not a productive attitude, you know. When someone takes the time to offer the advice for which you asked, it is usually better to take it as an honest effort to assist, and to read it carefully, and consider it even if you choose ultimately to dismiss it. It is assuredly not a personal attack.


I think it is worth examining how you reached the conclusion we were calling the plot stupid when those words appear in neither post.

 

[Daisie]

That is not a productive attitude, you know. When someone takes the time to offer the advice for which you asked, it is usually better to take it as an honest effort to assist, and to read it carefully, and consider it even if you choose ultimately to dismiss it. It is assuredly not a personal attack.
I think it is worth examining how you reached the conclusion we were calling the plot stupid when those words appear in neither post.

Sorry. I acted on instinct. I understand that you're trying to help, I really do. It's just that I don't see any ways around this, and the last plot that I made kind of sucked, too. I'm not exactly filled with confidence. Sorry again.


I also have no clue how to fix these issues. There's so many things wrong with it.

 

[NemoTheSurvivor]

It's a stupid plot.

The plot isn't stupid, but the intro clashes with the rest of the RP. Instead of having this elongated intro, just have the Dark Wizard stumble across the farm one day and turn the farmhands into chickens for fun. You circumvent every major issue with the introduction while at the same time getting to the meat of the RP faster.


Believe it or not, many ideas start off incoherent, if not completely impossible to understand. Trimming them into workable bits takes effort and practice. Don't beat yourself up just because you're inexperienced.


EDIT: phone typing sucks sometimes.

 

[Daisie]

The plot isn't stupid, but the intro clashes with the rest of the RP. Instead of having this elongated intro, just have the Dark Wizard stumble across the farm one day and turn the farmhands into chickens for fun. You circumvent every major issue with the introduction while at the same time getting to the meat of the RP faster.
Believe it or not, many ideas start off incoherent, if not completely impossible to understand. Trimming them into workable bits takes effort and practice. Don't beat yourself up just because you're inexperienced.


EDIT: phone typing sucks sometimes.

Okay. Thanks for the advice. But then how will they figure out about the whole thing with the Spirits and such? That's definitely something I don't want to leave out. Any advice..? :>


The animals don't know the Spirits personally or anything, so they can't simply 'tell the tale' of them.

 

[Grey]

That's quite alright - we all say things in the heat of the moment that we might regret.


There's less wrong than you might think, but the solutions are definitely not obvious. You can achieve a lot of the things you want by manipulating the players, but in order to do that you need the right groundwork. If you establish the tone, the world, and the kinds of characters you would encourage the players to make, you can easily lead them where you want.


To give you a very simple example, I had a plotline that involved finding a monster preying on homeless people and manipulating the police force - so the players were told that all characters had to be detectives, assigned to an unpopular lieutenant who was trying to clean up the department. This meant I could tell which clues specific characters would be drawn to follow up on; the detective with a knack for computers noticed a discrepancy in a vehicle's registration file, the alcoholic detective stumbled on a heroin-filled sac of human skin in his favourite late-night drinking spot.


Do check out those guides - I wrote them specifically to help with this kind of thing.

 

[Daisie]

That's quite alright - we all say things in the heat of the moment that we might regret.
There's less wrong than you might think, but the solutions are definitely not obvious. You can achieve a lot of the things you want by manipulating the players, but in order to do that you need the right groundwork. If you establish the tone, the world, and the kinds of characters you would encourage the players to make, you can easily lead them where you want.


To give you a very simple example, I had a plotline that involved finding a monster preying on homeless people and manipulating the police force - so the players were told that all characters had to be detectives, assigned to an unpopular lieutenant who was trying to clean up the department. This meant I could tell which clues specific characters would be drawn to follow up on; the detective with a knack for computers noticed a discrepancy in a vehicle's registration file, the alcoholic detective stumbled on a heroin-filled sac of human skin in his favourite late-night drinking spot.


Do check out those guides - I wrote them specifically to help with this kind of thing.

Okay... So. I need to build the world a bit more, and establish what kinds of characters will be participating, right? I'm still not quite sure how to do that... And from what I can tell, having them just be farmers will be quite difficult to pull off. Should I get rid of that idea entirely? Will it make the opening too rough?


I'm still not sure if I'm going in the right direction. Forgive me for not being the brightest, lol. I find myself trying to sound smart, but then babbling on about all the wrong facts.

 

[Grey]

Well, they're farmers now, but what if one or more of them used to be soldiers? What if one of them was a renegade scholar who delved into forbidden knowledge, and now hides out at this little farm? Your former soldiers can potentially fight off dragons, your forbidden scholar might wonder about the mountains - maybe they read about a mysterious shrine years ago and recent events remind them.


Now, you can always list potential backgrounds like this in the interest check, but if you were to write more about the setting and include details like 'following the war between Rivain and Licia, many conscripted farmers returned home carrying weapons from the battlefield and the experience of their campaign. Most pray they will never need them again." Or 'during the Quintine Heresy zealots to the young princess Ambra's radical new dogma of One Spirit were quick to burn at the stake those who stuck to the old ways. As a result, many priests and scholars were forced to flee the capital city and hide in the wilderness.'


Do you see what I mean?

 

[Daisie]

Well, they're farmers now, but what if one or more of them used to be soldiers? What if one of them was a renegade scholar who delved into forbidden knowledge, and now hides out at this little farm? Your former soldiers can potentially fight off dragons, your forbidden scholar might wonder about the mountains - maybe they read about a mysterious shrine years ago and recent events remind them.
Now, you can always list potential backgrounds like this in the interest check, but if you were to write more about the setting and include details like 'following the war between Rivain and Licia, many conscripted farmers returned home carrying weapons from the battlefield and the experience of their campaign. Most pray they will never need them again." Or 'during the Quintine Heresy zealots to the young princess Ambra's radical new dogma of One Spirit were quick to burn at the stake those who stuck to the old ways. As a result, many priests and scholars were forced to flee the capital city and hide in the wilderness.'


Do you see what I mean?

I think so... At least, I hope so. Man, maybe I shouldn't make a RP. This is a lot more complex than I thought, I just don't think I can do all that. It's a lot to do now, and it's also a lot to keep track of during the RP.


So...Establish a history of this land I'm making, right? So that the RPers have a better idea of what world they're getting into, and how they can make their characters fit into this world I'm making. I don't even have a lot of the landscape planned out, just this little area stated above..


Sorry for the short response, I wasn't expecting all this.

 

[Grey]

Well, I always say if you do this stuff first, you actually have less to keep track of - check out that worldbuilding primer when you can; I explain it more in depth there.


But yeah, context is very important. Like, based on your first post, I'm not sure what character I would make because I don't know what kind of world this is. I don't even know if it's medieval or modern day, so how can I be sure what kinds of things my character will do and know? If you establish what the world is normally like, the sudden appearance of violent dragons has more significance because players will understand this is something unusual.


You don't necessarily have to flesh out the rest of the land as long as there's enough detail of the central area to make it a believable place. You can make allusions to places and events further away, and if players latch onto those suggestions maybe they'll flesh them out for you when writing character backstories.


You should ask yourself 'why' a lot, and avoid answering 'because that's the plot.'

 

[Daisie]

Okay. I'll be sure to try and read over that when I can. All of this is very intimidating right now.


To be completely honest, I haven't decided if it's a fantasy world or a medieval world of some sort. I'm leaning slightly towards medieval though, I think it'd be more of a fitting category. But then again, there's a bit of fantasy in there with the whole 'magic' thing, with the sorcerer and all that. It just really depends on what you consider the line between fantasy and medieval is, I guess?


I think it'd be starting out in a olden and medieval world. That would make the discovery of magic pretty exciting, but still fitting. Right? :3

 

[Grey]

Well, look at popular current examples like Game of Thrones - the culture is medieval, and most characters don't believe in the supernatural, but they're actually living in a fantasy world and that revelation is an important element of the plot.


So you could even go with something WWII era (because I could see a Studio Ghibli movie with a plot like this) and introduce the magical stuff.


Hrm. There's a thought - try watching a few Ghibli movies like Princess Mononoke or Grave of the Fireflies. Especially if you've seen them before; it can be really valuable to watch these things a second time and try to understand the narrative decisions in them.


It may be intimidating, but these things take time and there's no reason to rush. It's honestly a good sign that even though you're intimidated, you haven't given up and are willing to learn.

 

[Daisie]

Hmm... Well, I try to avoid the WWII era, just because I'm not a fan of that style of world. It's never been something that's caught my interest, and it's something I don't really know about, at all. I'm more comfortable in a fantasy or medieval world, where I can bend the rules a bit more in case I make a small mistake.


I've never heard of those movies before. :< I might keep them in mind though.


Thanks, I'm trying my best. I never really saw this as something I could actually do, I guess. It feels more like I'm going from Simple RPing to Detailed. And that's really not an easy transition. O^O Thanks for your advice though. I had no idea what I was doing, I guess. xD


And I probably still don't, lol.

 

[Grey]

I'm always happy to help.


The master has a failed a thousand times where the novice has yet to try. It's good to admit when you're out of your depth, and it's good to recognize when you've made a mistake, but these are always learning opportunities - if you can identify these things, you can avoid or use them in future to do better.

 

[Daisie]

Cool! Wise words. :3 Though I think I'm going to put off the planning until later, because I'm really busy IRL. Probably wasn't the best time to post this thread, now that I think about it, lol. But I'll definitely keep this all in mind. Thank you!!


I'm gonna go rest my brain, and draw or something.

 

[Daisie]

@Grey , I came up with a cool little history for the land!! So go ahead and tear it to shreds, lol. I am prepared this time


Once there were two kingdoms. (I haven't decided the names yet) Kingdom A and Kingdom B. They had always been good, close allies for a long time. Helping each other out, living on the huge island of theirs. They helped each other expand, they exchanged resources, and everything was going fairly well between them. Their kingdoms were thriving.


After much, much time had passed, they had discovered that they were surrounded by a large sea, with waters so wild that nobody would dare cross them. And after much, much time had passed once more, the large island grew crowded. The citizens became restless, and unruly. More and more crime began to spread across the land as they also began running low on resources. The land was beginning to be filled with hate. The people of Kingdom A and Kingdom B began to create walls of stereotypes and rage, becoming bitter from the lack of supplies, as they became more and more expensive. This went on for around 5 years, and the people were constantly hungry, tired, and hating each other.


The crime escalated quickly between the two populations, and there was not much the Kings and Queens could do about it. So they arranged a meeting for the Kings, Queens, and associates of Kingdom A and Kingdom B to attend, and to attempt to solve this issue peacefully. The King and Queen of Kingdom A, however, were assassinated that day, by a skilled and clever man of Kingdom B dressed as a royal guard.


Confused, the young and naive prince of Kingdom A had to suddenly take control of the land. Being driven and yelled at by his even more upset and angry people, he had barely any choice but to declare war against Kingdom B.


5 years later of war and hate, Kingdom A had almost lost. The prince (Who is now the king) had realized his terrible, terrible mistake. He sent out 50 of their best and most sturdy ships out into sea, in a last hope of keeping Kingdom A alive. And not too long after those ships were sent out, Kingdom A had fallen.


50 ships were sent across the terrible stormy seas. Many of them had suffered from countless deaths, sickness, and undernourishment. The day they finally found the land on the other side, there were 13 ships left. They landed on the shores to find a new home, and a new place to rebuild Kingdom A. Over the years of hard work and rebuilding, they created a hamlet, that soon turned into a village, which then created a town. Faster than ever, the New Kingdom A grew, a rapidly increasing pace taking it's place.


15 years later, smoke filled the air in the distance. Kingdom B had suffered a terrible fire, from the few rebels left of Kingdom A that still lived on the other side of that nasty sea. It demolished much of their kingdom, and much of their supplies. Countless lives were lost. Kingdom B couldn't sail across the wild seas before, but now that their supplies had been burnt to a crisp, they seemed even more distant and separate. For sure now, New Kingdom A was truly alone. Cut off from the other Kingdom.


It is now 30 years after that event. New Kingdom A has flourished like never before, with all new land to explore, and many cities built. The population has been steadily increasing, and the streets begin to finally be quiet at night. Your character has been living in the big city, where they first landed down on the shores. But now, prices have been increasing, the area has gotten quite a bit fancier. It has been getting more expensive to live there, and it is about time to move to one of the smaller towns, on the rim.


Luckily, you have found a spot of land for a great price. It's farmland, built for livestock. The man even agreed that he'd give all of his livestock to you, as he had always wanted to be a blacksmith, not a farmer. His wife and friends simply dragged him into the farm business. He's also agreed to take care of the animals for one more week after you've moved in, so you can get all settled. Such a nice man! The only problem is that a few other people also want that spot of land.


After negotiating through some letters, you've come to the conclusion that it would be best if you were all roommates in the same big cabin. You'd each take a cut of the work, and you'd each work together to pay the bills. In fact, you're in the carriage right now, going to that spot of land just outside the small town. You can see it in the distance, it seems so peaceful. The horses are grazing in the distance, and you're beginning to hear the sound of a crowing rooster, as the sun hits midday.


Sooooo that's the beginning of our story! Critique away! :3


EDIT: I know I said I would stop planning this RP thing, but AAAAH I got ideas, lol. You cannot stop an RPer with ideas. -^-

 

[Grey]

Not a ton of criticism to offer right now, but it's good you followed the urge to work on it more. Use that drive when it's there.


Big step in the right direction, but there's still more to do. Is all of this history stuff you need the players to know immediately, or something they can learn about while playing?

 

[Daisie]

Not a ton of criticism to offer right now, but it's good you followed the urge to work on it more. Use that drive when it's there.
Big step in the right direction, but there's still more to do. Is all of this history stuff you need the players to know immediately, or something they can learn about while playing?

Yay! I did a good. :3


Hmm.. I'm not quite positive how I'd convey it during the RP. I'm sure there's some way, but nothing's really springing to mind. It's not something they'd really need. It's more there for character creation, I guess.

 

[Grey]

In that case, you need to worry a bit less about the timeline and more the effects of that timeline. What is the culture and technology of these kingdoms like? Do they have a religion? Is there a class or caste system? Have their historical wars affected their traditions or attitudes? Can you find a way to tie it into the plot more directly?


Okay, so, this would be a big read and I do not expect anyone to match it, but here's an example of the end result of applying the principles I outlined.