Character Creation and Development (Discussion)

[RealisticFantasy]

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Do you like character creation? Why or why not? What are your favorite aspects? Least favorite? Do you prefer to go in-depth or skim over the details about your character? How do you develop your character throughout your RP? Feel free to add more about your favorite characters (original or otherwise) and other character creation and development related details. For me, I love character creation when it's for a story that has an interesting background. I always aim to develop the most realistic and compelling characters. I enjoy delving into my character's motivations for their personality and likes and dislikes. I run on a lot of subtly to development character, such as the way they act towards a certain character or how they refer to themselves in their thoughts. For example, if they have a nickname that is associated with their past, as they shift away from their past personality, I would refer to them by increasingly using a different pseudonym. I feel like a lot of my development might go unnoticed but it's certainly there if someone bothered to analyze it.


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[Idea]

character creation really gets an "average" from me. It´s stressful in the sense that my characters consume A HECK LOT of my time, time which I´m not using on anything else, such as RPing in one of my many RPs, and I´m just paranoid like that, I suppose... The other bad thing, is that while the majority of people doesn´t seem to realize it, we all end up falling into patterns and given types of characters. Which is not all that bad, until you really start to be aware of it. Writing a character knowing you´ve written that type of character before, in a way, is frustrating, but sometimes there things that are harder to deviate than it seems.


The upside is that I adore creating new things and exporing the possibilities. I particularly enjoy manipulating the rules, not as in changing them, but as in using the rules to create something unexpected within them. I also enjoy the process of seeing the dots coming together and the character developing.


Possibly for that reason, but more likely because I think it just makes sense to, I always go as in-depth as I can in character creation. It kinda ticks me off when someone goes "oh, I´ll just develop/come up with it in the RP". I mean... roleplaying, subjective views aside, is getting into the shoes of the characters. There is no questioning that. I can say roleplaying is writing a story, others that it is exploring fantasies, etc... But all of those can usually be taken from roleplay and it still is roleplay. They alone, are not roleplay either. But getting into the character´s shoes IS roleplaying. You can´t take it out. And for that exact reason, you should ALWAYS know exactly what you´re roleplaying. Your can´t come up with your own personality as it is fit. A personality can grow and change, but there is still a starting line, and deciding to make it up along the way is opening the door for so much inconsistency and just plain wrong interactions...


Ah, sorry bout the rant...


Anyway, I think the above also kind of explains it: When developing IC, I try to go as in character as possible. I believe in striking a compromise between allowing things to flow naturally and controlling them just enough to allow the plot to progress.

 

[call me rae]

Well I tend to stick to the basics of a character in the beginning then built them up as the story progresses. However if asked to fill out a more detailed character sheet I certainly don't balk.


When it comes to making characters usually I have an idea or two circulating in my head that I just iron out. Sometimes it's based on what is needed for the plot and sometimes it's a hodge podge of people I know mashed up with canon characters from various fandoms.


I rarely use the same character twice so it's usually just working on someone that fits the plot or at least their intended use in the story.

 

[sakigamis]

I like character creation.... It's just that I kind of suck at making my own characters. >_> I ought to stick to the design aspect, really, because I suck at personalities.


The weird thing is that it's only with my own OCs that this happens? I can name a couple instances where I took a minor canon character that we don't know much about, analyzed all the little details, and fleshed them out until they were practically my own character, while still fully recognizable as who they are. But if I'm making my own character from scratch I draw a total blank, even though I generally do the same thing as with those canon characters (start out with a few key traits and an appearance, work things out from there). It drives me nuts trying to figure out why I can't develop my own characters the way I developed someone else's minor character. :/

 

[TyrantKingKuma]

I like creating characters. I can create NPC's on the fly with interesting backstories if I know the setting by heart. I also like creating interesting abilities or powers to go along with them. I particularly proud of a bunch of NPC I created once called "The Numbers" an organization of professional killers with a hierarchy and weird weapon related powers. They went from 5 to 1, each of them with a cardinal direction and mythical creature creating their name.


5: Western Fairy, was a british sharpshooter that used double rifles, one shot a cartridge that created a dust cloud with special gunpowder (Fairy Dust) and the other was an ignition package for the gundpoweder causing controlled and concentrated explosions thanks to the properties of the gunpowder. She was a blast (lol) to play with.

 

[Ammokkx]

I personally consider a good character sheet to be a simple one. Have the basic 'Name, Bio, Appearance, Personality' and any additional things that are required for the RP. No more. A character should be something you get little info over on the start but winds up unfolding and developing over time. I mean, you don't go in-depth with books either. They teach you all about their personality, likes, dislikes and so on over the course of the story. That's why I treat sheets the same way.


Needless to say, that makes my character development very important to me. I consider a good starting point to be as simple to the given concept as possible, e.g. 'Selfish Jerk' or 'Hyperactive Nice' and reveal their intricacies over time. I have a character in a certain Mecha RP for example, who is the poster child for 'Hyper Nice' and 'Cheerful'. I mentioned vaguely she breaks easily when alone, but didn't go into detail. Over the course of the RP I had her reveal more and more self-loathing thoughts over the course whilst she just talked to people with a smile, and even throw up at points due to some of the atrocities she needed to commit. She also mumbles a lot to herself about how things aren't as simple as everyone around her makes it out to be and is genuinely jealous of their optimism. I revealed hidden depths to that character slowly without having to mention it all directly in the sheet and let it slowly trickle in without making it look like an asspull. She's still flawed and will eventually learn to not feel as bad for herself as she does, but that's something for later.


I dunno. I may not have much of a clear point there, but this is how I feel about Character sheets and Character Development.

 

[Idea]

I personally consider a good character sheet to be a simple one. Have the basic 'Name, Bio, Appearance, Personality' and any additional things that are required for the RP. No more. A character should be something you get little info over on the start but winds up unfolding and developing over time. I mean, you don't go in-depth with books either. They teach you all about their personality, likes, dislikes and so on over the course of the story. That's why I treat sheets the same way.
Needless to say, that makes my character development very important to me. I consider a good starting point to be as simple to the given concept as possible, e.g. 'Selfish Jerk' or 'Hyperactive Nice' and reveal their intricacies over time. I have a character in a certain Mecha RP for example, who is the poster child for 'Hyper Nice' and 'Cheerful'. I mentioned vaguely she breaks easily when alone, but didn't go into detail. Over the course of the RP I had her reveal more and more self-loathing thoughts over the course whilst she just talked to people with a smile, and even throw up at points due to some of the atrocities she needed to commit. She also mumbles a lot to herself about how things aren't as simple as everyone around her makes it out to be and is genuinely jealous of their optimism. I revealed hidden depths to that character slowly without having to mention it all directly in the sheet and let it slowly trickle in without making it look like an asspull. She's still flawed and will eventually learn to not feel as bad for herself as she does, but that's something for later.


I dunno. I may not have much of a clear point there, but this is how I feel about Character sheets and Character Development.

isn´t that like... against the point? I mean, if the idea is to just let the character unveil, you wouldn´t need a sheet in the first place!


Plus, this is roleplaying we´re talking about. It is literally taking the role of somebody. Wouldn´t that person be who they are...BEFORE the action where that players out? It´s different from books, where you´re trying to just tell a story, but in roleplay, you´re doing more than that: you´re becoming someone else. Shouldn´t that someone else be concrete from the getgo?

 

[Ammokkx]

isn´t that like... against the point? I mean, if the idea is to just let the character unveil, you wouldn´t need a sheet in the first place!
Plus, this is roleplaying we´re talking about. It is literally taking the role of somebody. Wouldn´t that person be who they are...BEFORE the action where that players out? It´s different from books, where you´re trying to just tell a story, but in roleplay, you´re doing more than that: you´re becoming someone else. Shouldn´t that someone else be concrete from the getgo?

Seems like you and I think differently about it.


Yes, I do play as that character. But that character should never be complete from the start. I'm a fan of letting them be flawed and incomplete and letting all their intricacies slowly trickle in. Is it against the point? No, I don't think so. I'm still taking the role of someone else within a certain story. But every good story has flawed characters, in my opinion, that you don't fully know with just a glance. They should be different in the end compared to what they are at the start. They should mature, learn, evolve. Like a regular human being. We learn from experience, and so should our characters. We don't know someone completely with just a synopsis, so neither should the rest. That's, in my opinion, the beauty of a simple character sheet with good development.


Are you wrong for disagreeing? Nah. It's just the way I see it, and the way I like to enforce it in a RP.

 

[Idea]

Seems like you and I think differently about it.
Yes, I do play as that character. But that character should never be complete from the start. I'm a fan of letting them be flawed and incomplete and letting all their intricacies slowly trickle in. Is it against the point? No, I don't think so. I'm still taking the role of someone else within a certain story. But every good story has flawed characters, in my opinion, that you don't fully know with just a glance. They should be different in the end compared to what they are at the start. They should mature, learn, evolve. Like a regular human being. We learn from experience, and so should our characters. We don't know someone completely with just a synopsis, so neither should the rest. That's, in my opinion, the beauty of a simple character sheet with good development.


Are you wrong for disagreeing? Nah. It's just the way I see it, and the way I like to enforce it in a RP.

yes, but all that is perfectly doable with ANY character sheet. What´s to say a more complete CS can´t have all fo those things, the "intricacies slowly trickling in", the "maturing, learning and evolving"?


Besides, how can you take the role of someone you don´t know? You can´t. If you make it up along the way, that means that wasn´t really there, that the character was more like a robot than anything. Just adding up new personality traits as some random guy/girl wants it.


I´m really struggling to see your point of view on this, as it appears that you are suggesting that somehow having a more extensive and complete character sheet is detrimental to it´s development and display IC. Which is absurd.

 

[Ammokkx]

yes, but all that is perfectly doable with ANY character sheet. What´s to say a more complete CS can´t have all fo those things, the "intricacies slowly trickling in", the "maturing, learning and evolving"?
Besides, how can you take the role of someone you don´t know? You can´t. If you make it up along the way, that means that wasn´t really there, that the character was more like a robot than anything. Just adding up new personality traits as some random guy/girl wants it.


I´m really struggling to see your point of view on this, as it appears that you are suggesting that somehow having a more extensive and complete character sheet is detrimental to it´s development and display IC. Which is absurd.

Well, no, I wasn't trying to imply anything of the above.


I feel a CS, when you add too much details, you know too much of someone from the get-go. That's not exactly wrong per-say, but I just feel it's needless when you could explain the same thing in the RP. I also don't mean to say they shouldn't stick to what you wrote down. The girl I mentioned above has perfectly good reasons to act the way she does (Has no family, orphaned, forced into military). But I didn't explicitly say in her personality section "Has a habit of self-loathing" because I felt that was something that should've been discovered in the RP itself.


Again, I personally see a good character sheet as a simple and basic one. Does that make more detailed ones automatically bad? God, no! Any CS can be good. I personally just think a simple one is better than a detailed one. A character shouldn't be completely set in stone from the get-go, because that leaves no room for growing. That's just how I feel about it.

 

[Archie]

character creation really gets an "average" from me. It´s stressful in the sense that my characters consume A HECK LOT of my time.

This; it's definitely the most time consuming part for me because designing a person isn't simple in any way. I find it kind of boring to play characters that don't have intricacies or aren't ignorant/oblivious/ironic in some way. I see a lot of villains that are like "hes a perfect chess master and is good at a lot of things and suffered from tragedy so that's why he's evil", but it's way more fun IMO to play someone who thinks he/she's great but really isn't, or who is running from something, or suffers from totally normal problems blown out of proportion.


A lot of the times this means I have to write the history and personality together and delete it once or twice to create characters that are different than the ones I've played before (don't want to get typecast) but who also make sense as to how their past made them who they are. Once I've got a good one I'm kind of relieved because it gets a lot easier from there - you can just describe whatever they're feeling and they're interesting as they are, don't need to embellish your posts or anything. If I doze off and make a boring one I feel like I need to do something "special" to stick out.

 

[Idea]

Well, no, I wasn't trying to imply anything of the above.
I feel a CS, when you add too much details, you know too much of someone from the get-go. That's not exactly wrong per-say, but I just feel it's needless when you could explain the same thing in the RP. I also don't mean to say they shouldn't stick to what you wrote down. The girl I mentioned above has perfectly good reasons to act the way she does (Has no family, orphaned, forced into military). But I didn't explicitly say in her personality section "Has a habit of self-loathing" because I felt that was something that should've been discovered in the RP itself.


Again, I personally see a good character sheet as a simple and basic one. Does that make more detailed ones automatically bad? God, no! Any CS can be good. I personally just think a simple one is better than a detailed one. A character shouldn't be completely set in stone from the get-go, because that leaves no room for growing. That's just how I feel about it.

While I don´t oppose disagreeing (everyone´s got their own opinions, as you said), the issue still stands out: You just implied that, tendencially at least, character sheets with more details leave no room for growing, which is absurd. Character sheets with more detail have just as much room for growing as any others, if not more, since they actually have somewhere to grow FROM rather to be made up along the way, a problem that I can´t stop emphasizing: Making stuff up along the way is an invitation for the dread known as a metagaming. The usage of OOC information to aid your character. A prime example that I´ve seen countless times, is when a character is suddenly super-suspicious of everyone because they OOC know it´s a trap.


I don´t say everyone who makes things up along the way is like this, but that, without really sacrificing anything but a few more minutes, you are making cases like the above several times more likely. A lot of the times, people don´t even really realize what they´re doing when they do this kind of thing.

 

[call me rae]

Also to further on @Ammokkx being too detailed in a CS can also lead to you kind of pigeonholing yourself. People grow and change as they experience new things.


To use a kind of silly example : when I was a kid I hated onions. But now that I'm an adult I love them. And the difference is as I grew up I was introduced to more and more dishes with onions in them and thus got over my initial dislike.


So it's kind of the same thing with starting out with a basic foundation. You basically start with the bare bones and have your character grow and change as they experience life in the roleplay.


Like how I learned to like onions just by eating them more.

 

[Ammokkx]

While I don´t oppose disagreeing (everyone´s got their own opinions, as you said), the issue still stands out: You just implied that, tendencially at least, character sheets with more details leave no room for growing, which is absurd. Character sheets with more detail have just as much room for growing as any others, if not more, since they actually have somewhere to grow FROM rather to be made up along the way, a problem that I can´t stop emphasizing: Making stuff up along the way is an invitation for the dread known as a metagaming. The usage of OOC information to aid your character. A prime example that I´ve seen countless times, is when a character is suddenly super-suspicious of everyone because they OOC know it´s a trap.
I don´t say everyone who makes things up along the way is like this, but that, without really sacrificing anything but a few more minutes, you are making cases like the above several times more likely. A lot of the times, people don´t even really realize what they´re doing when they do this kind of thing.

Well, no. Adding more details does not automatically remove room for growth. It's when a character is completely set in stone, one way and one way only, that's when the room for growth stops.


And metagaming is a personal issue that nobody should do. I personally don't do it because that is straight OOC. My character never learned about said trap, so why should they know about it? I don't feel that has anything to do with a CS. That's just the player being a problem.

 

[Ammokkx]

Also to further on @Ammokkx being too detailed in a CS can also lead to you kind of pigeonholing yourself. People grow and change as they experience new things.
To use a kind of silly example : when I was a kid I hated onions. But now that I'm an adult I love them. And the difference is as I grew up I was introduced to more and more dishes with onions in them and thus got over my initial dislike.


So it's kind of the same thing with starting out with a basic foundation. You basically start with the bare bones and have your character grow and change as they experience life in the roleplay.


Like how I learned to like onions just by eating them more.

This is kind of a more concrete form of what I am trying to say.

 

[Idea]

Also to further on @Ammokkx being too detailed in a CS can also lead to you kind of pigeonholing yourself. People grow and change as they experience new things.
To use a kind of silly example : when I was a kid I hated onions. But now that I'm an adult I love them. And the difference is as I grew up I was introduced to more and more dishes with onions in them and thus got over my initial dislike.


So it's kind of the same thing with starting out with a basic foundation. You basically start with the bare bones and have your character grow and change as they experience life in the roleplay.


Like how I learned to like onions just by eating them more.

I must be dumb or something cause I don't see how that has ANYTHING to do with detail in the CS. I've said it quite a few times by now: More CS details does not impair in any way character growth. People grow as they experience new things, that is correct, but that doesn't mean they didn't have a concrete full personality BEFORE said growth.


Taking your example, before being introduced to new foods, you disliked onions. Imagining a character that goes through the same process over an RP you should put in the CS they didn't like Onions and then show that growth over time.


As far as I can see it at least, that is directly better than having growth out of nowhere. And, seriously speaking, if there was nothing before, can it really be called "growth" or "character development"? It seems very...half-hearted to me.

Well, no. Adding more details does not automatically remove room for growth. It's when a character is completely set in stone, one way and one way only, that's when the room for growth stops.
And metagaming is a personal issue that nobody should do. I personally don't do it because that is straight OOC. My character never learned about said trap, so why should they know about it? I don't feel that has anything to do with a CS. That's just the player being a problem.

hmmmm...that is true, up to a point. Putting something in the CS doesn't mean it's "set in stone" , at least not in the sense that it can't change over he RP. Grow. Organically. The CS is just the starting state and staple for what should be assumed out of your character. Now, they are "set in stone" in the sense of being established as being that in the beggining, but that's not soemthing taht hinders character growth, in fact, it is a basic requirement for it. You have to grow FROM something INTO something.


Look at real people: we change, but we were always something BEFORE we changed.


As for meta gaming, yes it's a personal issue. I didn't say your method leads to meta gaming, but that metagaming is in a sense promoted by said method, and explained why: there isn't anything concrete to say your character should act in this or that way, so there is nothing stopping you from along the more convinient route. And how do you know that route? Through OOC.

 

[call me rae]

As for meta gaming, yes it's a personal issue. I didn't say your method leads to meta gaming, but that metagaming is in a sense promoted by said method, and explained why: there isn't anything concrete to say your character should act in this or that way, so there is nothing stopping you from along the more convinient route. And how do you know that route? Through OOC.

Okay I'm sorry that is kind of rude. I realize you don't mean to be but that basically comes across as saying your way of doing things is right and the way that @Ammokkx is doing it is wrong.


When it's all a matter of preference. There is no right or wrong way to develop a character. You have your way and that works for you and I have a different way that works for me.


As to metagaming that is a player specific problem which is a different topic entirely. I know this because I have done both styles of CS sheet - detailed and simple - and have had people metagame my characters using each style.


Because metagaming doesn't have anything to do with a character sheet, specific type of character, etc. It's all down to how that particular player chooses to play their character. And if that person wants to force a specific scenario on their partner they will find away to do that whether it's using information from the CS, OOC or what have you.


And even then it's not necessarily a bad thing. It's all in your own personal preferences. Some people don't mind metagaming and other people hate it with a passion.


That doesn't make metagaming right or wrong it just means that some people will feel a certain way and other people will feel another way.

 

[Ammokkx]

@Idea I don't think we're going to see eye-to-eye here. Agree to disagree?

 

[Idea]

Okay I'm sorry that is kind of rude. I realize you don't mean to be but that basically comes across as saying your way of doing things is right and the way that @Ammokkx is doing it is wrong.
When it's all a matter of preference. There is no right or wrong way to develop a character. You have your way and that works for you and I have a different way that works for me.


As to metagaming that is a player specific problem which is a different topic entirely. I know this because I have done both styles of CS sheet - detailed and simple - and have had people metagame my characters using each style.


Because metagaming doesn't have anything to do with a character sheet, specific type of character, etc. It's all down to how that particular player chooses to play their character. And if that person wants to force a specific scenario on their partner they will find away to do that whether it's using information from the CS, OOC or what have you.


And even then it's not necessarily a bad thing. It's all in your own personal preferences. Some people don't mind metagaming and other people hate it with a passion.


That doesn't make metagaming right or wrong it just means that some people will feel a certain way and other people will feel another way.

I apologize if I offended anyone, that was not my intention. I don't think I deserve to be called rude, though, for speaking my mind: if I thought her way was bad and mine was good (which I don't, but hypothetically speaking) and was arguing on that sense, that isn't being rude, that is tying to help. Either by showing her she's wrong and help her improve or being shown I was wrong and improving my own way of viewing things.


I agree that there is no right or wrong way to develop a character, but I genually think the most complete and extensive way is typically better. Everyone has the right to like what they like and I have no intention of changing that, but when put in an objective light, can it really be said there is no difference quality-wise?


And I repeat: I didn't say metagaming was a consequence of simple character sheets. I said, the less a character sheet has the easier it is to disguise metagaming, which in turn promotes it's usage.


Metagaming isn't exclusive or ever-present on either form of doing things, just inherently more likely in one than the other. As for the rest of the reasons presented for simpler character sheets, a lot if not all of them are just things that can be done just as well or in some cases better with more complex and complete character after sheets.

 

[Idea]

@Idea I don't think we're going to see eye-to-eye here. Agree to disagree?

Fine by me. I stand by my point, and was just trying to see your side of things, sorry for the trouble.

 

[Ammokkx]

"her" "she's wrong"

I'm a 17 year old male just like you, buster. =P

 

[Idea]

I'm a 17 year old male just like you, buster. =P

Oops, sorry. It's a problem I have, I look at profile pics and assume they match the gender of the user, sorry!

 

[Tenebrous]

I honestly feel that I don't put as much effort as my friends do. I mean, I'm sitting here with 3 paragraphs biography, 1 paragraph personality and 1 line motivation. While my friends go ham. Rocking with a whopping 6 paragraph biography and personality that might as well have been a repeat of their biography.


I normally don't pay too much attention to character sheets. Sure, they let me have a gist of the character as a whole; their aspirations and what not. But too much detail is just a turn-off. It just makes me feel that I know the character personally and breaks my 'In-Character' mode(I write in third person but I like to imagine myself as the character).


Generally, I lean more towards the development side, since that is the most unpredictable course. I have no idea what sort of events affect the character most nor do I know how well the character responds to it; maybe even learn from the experience. Things like this make it more interesting. Have the skeleton, then flesh it out by throwing the skeleton in a pit of lava and other deadly things that we all secretly enjoy flinging our characters into(adventure, am I right?)

 

[Chennn]

contrary to most responses in this thread, character creation is one of my


most favorite parts of roleplaying. i go really deep into the details -- heck,


even the most trivial detail could be something. i like making my characters


as ""human"" and realistic as possible so i don't care that much how much time


i spend creating them. majority, if not all, of my characters are a constant wip


tbh.


of course i only put the more necessary info on my character sheets but that


doesn't mean my info for my character ends there. i always have more in mind


and in my phone's notepad haha. actually, even in stories ( be it movie, novel,


graphic novel, tv, etc. ), characters are my favorite part.


oh and ofc, character development and interactions are something i love too.


i just love anything involving details and muses lol. which is also why im so fricking


meticulous in worldbuilding /sob

 

[Grey]

Pers'nally, I've come around to feeling that hyper-detailed, high wordcount characters are a hindrance for two reasons.


1. As a GM, I need to be able to read, contextualize, and use character sheets in a time-efficient manner. I do not want to dig through a thousand words of amateur prose to get to relevant details. I get that writing it was fun for you, and that's why we're here, but don't automatically assume it'll be as fun for everyone else to read it.


2. I would prefer to see backstory and personality expressed through the text of the RP, in the words and actions of characters. Having personal reference is practically a necessity, of course, but I wouldn't want to overdo it.