A Ninth Nation?

Obsidian Soul

Obsidian Soul

Member
I was looking through Autochthonians and I was thinking how strange it was that in almost five millennia, the Autochthonians had not formed a Ninth Nation, one not founded by the Eight Heroes.  Of course, it could be that the Divine Ministers did not want such a thing to exist, so they did not tolerate any band of exiles to form into such a thing, but what if they did tolerate it.  Autochthon is unimaginably huge, the size of the Earth if his organs are the size of continents, and while the bottom and top one-fifth of him is Smoke and Oil respectively, and a fifth of his diameter in a cylinder is Lightning and Steam, and another third of his diameter is Crystal, that still leaves one-half of the total of his volume, the equivalent of one-half of the total volume of the Earth, as Metal.  That, my friends, is around five hundred billion cubic kilometers.  If only a one-thousanth of that is livable space, assuming an average height of one kilometer, Autochthon would have five hundred million square kilometers of habitable space, the equivalent of the Earth.  I doubt more than a one-thousanth of that is inhabited by the Eight Nations.


I proposes that the Eight Nations are in the part of Metal that is closest to  Crystal and that there is a lot of livable space in Autochthon that could be inhabited.  If so, there could easily be a Ninth Nation, let's call it Union, where the riff-raff of Autochthon lives.  As all of its citizens are descended from exiles from the other Eight Nations, the people of Union are more independent and more innovative than the people of the rest of Autochthon.  They are, in many ways, the true disciples of the sleeping Primordial.


Of course, the people of Union are only rebels by the considerations of Autochtonian society.  They are, by Creation standards, quite polite and calm.  They are more advanced than the rest of Autochthon because of their rebellious nature.  They question and experiment.  The Eight Divinities see this as useful and have assisted promising exiles to reach Union.  It is within Union that the Adamant Caste is built and maintained.  The Adamant Caste is one thousand strong and, while loyal to Union, they are also assigned to assist the Divinities in anywat possible.


 


The people of Union have been more acutely aware of Autochthon's problems than the Eight Nations.  They live far closer to the Far Reaches and, while it has provided them with more of the Magical Materials than the other nations combined, they have been faced with danger since the first.  Their cities tend to be more fortified and more protected than the cities of the other Nations.


It is within Union that one finds the technology to create both the Alchemical Essence Channelers and the Alchemical God-Blooded, mortal humans who were 'adopted' by elder Alchemicals through the use of the Adoption Matrix, an Alchemical Stamina Charm that requires a Stamina and Essence 5 to install, 30 motes and one permanent Willpower to use, and 5 motes to install.  Both the Essence Channelers and God-Blooded are allowed to permanently install Alchemical Charms.  What the Essence Channelers lack in versatility they potentially make up in raw power and what the God-Blooded lack in raw power they make up in versatility.  Neither can use Alchemical Weavings.
 
I find myself wishing I could get the Autocthonians book. There's apparantly so much good stuff in it, nearly everyone around here seems to approve of it.


Also if I had the Autocthonians book I wouldn't have to make up Artifacts to approximate their technology in my own games... oh well.


Acting more stereotypically of myself, I wonder why Auto didn't take any Dragon Kings with him... or make new ones?
 
Why no Dragon Kings with the Machine God? Likely since their not really his pets. A bigger question might be why no Mountain Folk...and seems likely to be answered with,"Huh? I made Mountain Folk? Oh, yeah. Heh. I've made so many things I kind of get lost in them all. See this nifty new thing I came up with? It's called the Loom of Fate. I'm working on a new one for my own place...I figure best to test it on some other schmuck's place instead of my own..."
 
I swear to God' date=' my hatred would be enough to kill you across the Atlantic. I fucking promise.[/quote']
You realise, I'm doing it deliberately now. In fact, I've forestalled developing several good, non-Dragon-King-related ideas, just to maintain my image and make you mad.


Just to let you know.


On the subject of slowly draining off CW's sanity points, I had an idea. Combining Alchemical cyborg technology with a Half-Dragon Night Caste Solar and training it with both pirate and ninja skills, I need only add the capacity to shoot flaming guitars in order to create the coolest thing ever. I call it the amalgamawesome.
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The Mountain Folk are linked to Gaia due to the fact that they were created when she and Cytherea made Creation.  Autochthon left in a hurry and did not have enough time to figure out the problem.  One of the scenarios in Autochthon is what would happen if he awoke with the solution.  He would free the Jadeborn from the Great Geas, dump out all of the humans and Alchemical Exalted, take up all of the Jadeborn and ascend to his next stage of evolution.


The Dragon Kings are a bit too powerful for his Divinities to control in large masses, I imagine, and they are a pretty individualistic and violent bunch.  Who knows though, perhaps there is a large colony in the Far Reaches, beyond where any of the Eight Nations can safely reach, where a crystalline cylinder one thousand kilometers tall and one hundred kilometers in radius holds the gardens and hunting grounds of three million Dragon Kings and their mortal servants.  It would take up less than .01% of Metal, a little more than 31 million cubic kilometers, and it could easily have 30 million square kilometers of living space, about the area of the Americas.  With their phenomenal abilities at crafting, there isn't much that the Dragon Kings could not do as long as they get enough materials, and five millennia is a lot of time to build crap.  They might have had to create a varient of the Path of Solid Earth in order to manipulate the Metal, but it could be possible.  The Dragon Kings could also act as Autochthons secondary immune system.  After all, they love a good fight.
 
*chuckles* Because after all, Jadeborn are much more useful than immortal semi-automaton servitors that aren't tied with elemental Earth. While mortals aren't useful at all as a supply of new soul steel. :) And no, I'm not laughing at you, but at the idea itself...which is entirelly the realm of some of the WW writers. Still, on the whole it is a very good book. A little sad that sometimes for a few details you still need to pull out Time of Tumult...but very well written overall. And it kills Gem. A lot.
 
I suppose it begs the question then, is this newer nation founded around one or two Alchemicals?


More importantly, considering the hostile nature of the Autocthonia, would it make a great deal of sense to found a new nation?  Travel far enough, through deadly ground, to start a nation from scratch?


The first Nations were prepared, and have grown, but at their core, they have been very controlled affairs, and by separating, they compete less for resources.


So, you want to add a Ninth Nation, which will be behind the other Nations, drastically, in both size, population, and the protection  of their Alchemical guardians, and put themselves in very deadly ground, before they can found their state, and what about setting up tram lines to it?  


Considering the Nations expand to meet their populations, the pressures to found a new nation are...what?


Just because there is space, doesn't mean that it's very attractive.  Take a look at the description of The Reaches again. And the Far Reaches.


How you gonna go and found a nation in an environment like that?  It's not like going upstream from Jamestown to found a new settlement.  


If you have Autocthon "wake up" and dump all the humans, then you've just got a Moutain Folk game, or a game based on the war between the Mountain Folk as they take back their master.


Either way, not much fun for an Alchemical game, as the Machine God's will would be pretty obvious, and the Alchemical would be dumping their former charges.


Not much fun--unless you like running one sided war stories.
 
I suppose that dumping all the souls in Autocthonia back into the Well of Souls to keep The Big A powered up makes some sense, but sort of seems like a waste in resources and time.


It also doesn't sound like much of a set up for games, unless you really want to have a Mountain Folk game set in Autocthonia.
 
I would never do an Alchemical game where Autochthon wakes up and frees the Jadeborn.  It would mean the end of humanity, either in Autochthon or in Creation itself.


The Jadeborn are an awesome race in themselves.  I like their Charms and I like the idea of the Endless Wars.  You know who the enemy is and you know that they will eat your entrials while you are still kicking if they capture you.  It's not about good or evil, with the exception of perhaps a few more enlightened Underground races that may be cautious allies to the Jadeborn, it is about survival.


The Jadeborn stories would have a tendency to resemble Alien and Aliens 2, two of my favorite movies.  They are science fiction and horror.  Yes, you are Underground, but is that any different than being in a space station or on a colony dome on the Moon?  It's not like the Jadeborn can survive on the surface for long.
 
You still didn't address why a bunch of folks, and Alchemicals would brave the Reaches or even the Far Reaches, to settle a vulnerable population, and build a whole city from scratch?
 
I haven't read the Alchemical book. What are Jadeborn? I'm gathering from Obsidian's comments they're another race, who wars with the Alchemicals in Autocthon? Am I missing something (other than reading the frickin' book).......
 
Vanman said:
I haven't read the Alchemical book. What are Jadeborn? I'm gathering from Obsidian's comments they're another race, who wars with the Alchemicals in Autocthon? Am I missing something (other than reading the frickin' book).......
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Nope, they're from the Fae book. They're the old race that Autochthon first made. The Firstborn.
 
So how and/or why would Autocthon free them? Are they imprisoned in his body? Or is this just an idea that someone leaped to on their own?
 
The Jadeborn are a offshoot of the Fair Folk that got trapped inside Creation as it was being made from chaos.  All of this is described in detail in the Fair Folk book, but I'm getting ready to move so my books are packed until I get to the new place, so this is off the top of my head.  Please pardon any mistakes.


During his time before the Primordial War, Auto crossed Creation looking at all the cool stuff and tinkering with the things he found.  He eventually came across a chunk of Jade imbued with the spirit of one of the Fae.  He shaped it into a humanoid shape, set it to one side, and pretty much forgot about it.  The Jadeborn slowly developed on its own, and in its travels found more Jade with spirits inside that he forged in his own likeness.  Being the children of the great Maker, they were also skilled craftsmen and developed many items of great wonder in their home underneith the Imperial Mountain.  


Much time went by.  Eventually, the Jadeborn were able to get the attention of Auto, and he was quite taken with them.  With their help, He created many of the artifacts used by the Solars in the Primordial War.  ONce the war was over, Auto saw that His presence in Creation would be a constant reminder to the Gods of their betrayal and started to make plans to leave before they turned on Him.  Before he could leave, the Solars made him place a Geas on the Jadeborn, forever binding them to their underground home, able to leave for reletively short times only.  He then gathered up his most loyal followers, kidnapped thousands more, and bolted out into the Void, leaving his 'children' behind.


Since the Jadeborn live under the Imperial Mountain, they have had to make treaties with the Shogunate, and later, the Empress.  They send tribute to the surface in the form of Jade that they mine, and provide a small detatchment of troops to serve the Empire.  Its not many; no more than a few hundred.  I don't remember the exact number anymore.


One of the things discussed in the Autothonian book is what would happen if the Maker was restored to full strength after his long sleep in the Void.  ONe thing mentioned is that he has the ability to release the Geas and call his servants back to his side.


Like I said, this is all from memory so there is probably a few details off, but that is the story of the Jadeborn and their Geas.
 
Thanks for that, Sherwood. Even if some of the details are incorrect, I now have a basic idea of who the Jadeborn are, and that's what I was looking for.


Cheers.
 
I agree with Jakk, the servants of the machine god struggle for the materials to keep autochton fuctioning and building what they need. Investing time and ressources in completely new and unneccessary infrastructure does not sound like some logical.


However if big A tells one of his ancient cities to relocate and build up a new nation it is still possible.... I just can't see a reason why he would do so. Hmmm well perhaps he wants a nation at some important part of his body to keep that free of any wird stuff. but that is a far stretch to be honest.
 
Vanman said:
Thanks for that, Sherwood. Even if some of the details are incorrect, I now have a basic idea of who the Jadeborn are, and that's what I was looking for.
Cheers.
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No problem.  Glad to help.   :wink:
 
The Eight Nations have been tossing out exiles and other rejects for five millennia.  It could be that the Eight Divinities needed an unconventional force of mortals in the Far Reaches to act as a first line of defense against the Void and other threats.  They did not want to involve the people of the Eight Nations because they are too fanatical, too set in their ways and too useful where they are.  The people of the Eight Nations would not want to go outside of the 'safe' area of Autochthon, so the Eight Divinities would need people who didn't have a choice.  Thus, Union would have been founded by exiles and renegades who were given the technology of the Adamant Caste, so that they would have a chance of surviving, in exchange for a more freeform service than what the Eight Nations do.
 
*chuckles* Because after all' date=' Jadeborn are much more useful than immortal semi-automaton servitors that aren't tied with elemental Earth. While mortals aren't useful at all as a supply of new soul steel. :) And no, I'm not laughing at you, but at the idea itself...which is entirelly the realm of some of the WW writers. Still, on the whole it is a very good book. A little sad that sometimes for a few details you still need to pull out Time of Tumult...but very well written overall. And it kills Gem. A lot.[/quote']
oh no you di'int.


the exalted were afraid of the mountain folk. remember before the great geas they all had artisan strength, and genius. plus if i recall they are 10 million in strength and had been nearly immortal.


yea. the friggin Exalteds were scared, they knew those boys below were fighting geniuses with the capabilities to create weapons unparalleled by anyone. remember they are the guys that supplied the exalted.


if the Geas was broken, then all the mountainfolk would be artisan equivalents, they would win the endless war, and turn there attention on to the surface. you have to consider that they host the biggest army in all creation, they have the biggest stock pile of artifacts, and if enlightened they are deadly essence weilders. nothing in creation could stop us. 8)
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I'm not saying the Jadeborn wouldn't be useful. I'm saying that dumping all the humans would be stupid. Stupid beyond what seems likely for Autochthon. Even if all else fails, Jadeborn can't replace damaged Soul Steel parts...not leaving ghosts.
 
What about a mix of the Jadeborn and humans?


And what is the point of the ninth nation in Autocthonia?


New innovations and Charms for the Autocthon Exalts?


New tech levels?


Cybertech?


Genetic manipulation?


How could a normal human pull off Artifacts?


Or would it be Artifact level tech or First Age tech?


You don't need Essence to power a sawmill or a prosthetic limb.
 
A literal mixture of Jadeborn and human is a God-Blooded without any access to Charms or, if they are born from Artisan or Enlightened parents, some access to Jadeborn Charms.


I would say that based on the fact that the Ninth Nation includes the best of the worst, so to speak, they would have more than a few unique innovations.  Perhaps they would have an augmentation that would grant the equivalent of Essence Channeler but would allow the mortal to permanently install up to (Willpower) Alchemical Charms as opposed to learning up to (Willpower) Spirit Charms.  They might even have an Essence 8+ Alchemcial Charm that would allow the Alcemical Exalt to transform vast numbers of mortals into God-Blooded that were capable of buying Alchemical Charm Slots and istalling any Alchemical Charm that they have sufficient Essence for.  


At the least, I would hav them have a vast variety of Bioenhancements.  Level one bioenhancements would craft replacements for hands, feet and simple organs.  Level two would craft replacements for arms, legs and complex organs.  Level three could mimic the effects of Poxes or essence one Alcemical Charms.  Level four could mimic the effects of Afflictions or essence two Alchemical Charms.  Level five could mimic the effects of Blights or essence three Alchemical Charms.  It should take one week to craft level one, one month to craft level two, one or more seasons to craft level three to five.
 
Jakk, nothing in Exalted is particularly balanced.  The Half-Caste God-Blooded children of Solars, Lunars (non-beastmen), Sidereals and Abyssals all have access to Celestial level Charms.  Is it balanced that they have access to such Charms while God-Blooded, Demon-Blooded and Ghost-Blooded only have access to Spirit Charms/Arcanoi?  Probably not, but WW seems to only be concerned about balance within kind and not between kind.  


Just as certain God-Blooded have access to more powerful Charms than other God-Blooded, one could designed certain Essence Channelers to have access to more powerful Charms than other Essence Channelers.  The Alchemical Exalted are expensive to produce and maintain, the Vats require enourmous resources.  It would make sence to have more limited troops who could serve as a defensive force while the Alchemicals are used for offense and special ops.  


On second thought, however, I think that bioenhancements should not be able to mimic Alchemical Charms.  The Science might give the mortal the technical know how to create basic Alchemical Charm, someone other than Alchemicals have to be able to or the Alchemicals would be spending all of their time making their own Charms, but I think that bioenhancements for mortals should be limited to mimicking the effects of Mutations.  I would personally allow them to create a bioenhancement that gave them Alchemical Essence Channeler, but I could see how it could be problematic in other games.  After all, if WW cannot be bothered to worry about game balance, it is up to the STs to worry about it.
 
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