Too Many Hats?

[Greenbriar]

Initial Disclaimer: this is not an interest check.


Hi guys,


I've been working on a roleplay idea I'd enjoy both running and playing (still likely a month or so off before I Interest Check it) which ideally involves 3-6 characters traveling together aboard a main vessel for plotly reasons - they have a day job after all. They tend to both get hired for adventures, as well as some adventures coming to find them while they're determinedly trying to do anything but. Sound familiar? Firefly is certainly an influence (more so than Serenity) although there are distinct differences in both setting and story so it's not simply a reskin.


I'm doing some world building now, and I intend to GM this (though I'm certainly not precious about it and fully intend to pick my players' brains for story ideas they'd enjoy seeing come into play). I also have a character I'd love to play in this setting, who would be the captain of said vessel.


So my question is, am I taking on too many hats and not leaving the players enough agency? And if so, what should I do to address this?


I could simply launch it as a 1x1 and ask my prospective writing partner if they're happy to double, but that has its own pitfalls - and rightly or wrongly, 1x1 tends to have stronger romantic influences than I want for this.


I could simply run the game and not use my character, but I have been and will put a lot of work into this and I feel it'd be a shame to leave her out. 


I could design the setting then try to coax another user to GM so I can play, but that seems laughably unfair to them.


What can I do to fix or minimize the problem - or am I just overthinking the whole thing?


End disclaimer: I do this sometimes. 

 

[AtlannianSpy]

If you find yourself with too many hats a good, high quality hat rack can really help organise them and bring a classical flair to your living space.


More seriously though I've certainly been in similar situations, having ideas that I would rather play in then GM or just not having the time or energy to bring an idea that really grabs me to life. It seems like what you want is a good Co-GM, if you find someone passioante about your idea that you can work with well and keep them in the loop they can take a lot of the pressure off running a group RP and you can even do things like trading off by arc, running the antagonists and larger story yourself for one story and then letting your Co Gm do it while you participate more with your player character. Of course good Co- Gms aren't always easy to find but it can be well worth it.

 

[zanarkand]

You should totally play and gm if that's what you want to do. I do all the time, even in dice games and if anyone has a problem with it you might want to ask them what they have against having a good time lol


As long as you're not a butthead and make everything always go better for your character as opposed to everyone else's then I don't see a problem with your character being the captain. You might want to open up permanent positions on the ship for everyone else though too just to be fair. Go all Star Trek with a Science Officer, Doctor, Navigator, Communications Officer etc.

 

[Alexandra]

To solve this, you need to pin down what kind of experience you want to have, and also give the others.


For my part, I never understand being both GM and player at the same time. I can't reconcile it. When I GM, my game is all about my players; they're the stars of the show, and that's how it should be. If I'm playing, I'll be taking care of my character's motivations first and foremost, so doubling up screams conflict of interest to me, but you can easily enough solve the desire to play characters and also GM by creating a selection of neat NPCs to populate your game for the players to interact with.

 

[Greenbriar]

Thanks guys, you've given me a lot to think about.


I'm reassured that there are different points of view on this, so there's not an obvious answer I'm just missing. 

 

[Grey]

Do you have a very specific plot in mind, or just the setting and skeleton?


Pers'nally, I find that giving players too much agency is a mistake if you want to stick to a coherent plot, and letting them have too much leeway over the setting can lead to something tonally inconsistent. This is even more the case without a fixed system. 


On the other hand, a well-defined setting and consistent rules for the function of that setting allows players to better grasp the limits of the whole affair. They can then make world-building contributions that fit with the overall thematic and tonal direction of the RP (players of mine have contributed animals, locations, and organizations that all fit perfectly with my vision but that I simply never thought of), and their contribution to the plot is based on the actions of their characters. You can let them steer the plot by examining the kind of character they've made, and the kind of decisions they make, but maintain immersion and tension by keeping this subtle.


For example, let's say a player has given their character a history of boarding actions and hand-to-hand combat. You can reasonably guess that the player wants opportunities to board ships and brawl with people, and therefore tie elements of the plot into relevant scenes and approaches. Have they referenced NPCs or locations in their backstory? Try to use them organically, reincorporating them to keep the character relevant to the direction of the plot.


As a veteran of traditional roleplaying, I never have a character in games I run. I have a stable of NPCs I like, but I stay out of the game and main plot as a protagonist because then, well, why should the players bother? I know the world and plot, and when things get difficult, their characters are apt to turn to my character to solve the problem or pick a way forward. Even subconsciously players are likely to defer to a GMPC. 


But I see a lot of RPs on the site use the GM as participant model, so maybe those actually work. I wouldn't know; I've never seen it.


Here, I've written some guides that may be useful even if you choose not to apply every element or even find you disagree with them.

 

[Grey]

Oh, and if you don't need to stick to a fixed plot and have a detailed setting, you can always get someone else to GM a story in this world for you after your turn running it. 

 

[zanarkand]

Having a semi-set plot and a GMPC only really works out if there's a level of trust between you and your players. And even then you should only do it if you feel like you can trust yourself to not give away the ending, solution or whatever it is that the characters are trying to accomplish. You also have to have a level of distance in your mind between your character and the plot itself and this only comes with practice. I mean, I've done it for a long time with my friends and strangers so there's a certain amount of practice that it might take.


Another way to perhaps make players feel better about it is to world build together. Maybe set up a skeleton to the world and set the tone and themes but maybe give them a little bit of control over what goes where and all that. But then again I'm more of a collaborative and relaxed GM so it might not be for you and that's okay.

 

[Greenbriar]

Thanks @Grey and @zanarkand - I'd been leaning this way since my last post, but reading your thoughts settled it. There's more self-insertion in my character than I'd realized, and while I do


feel that's manageable I'd be happier keeping her and running the world in separate brains until I have more experience with this. My background is writer, so I'd prefer to err on the side of giving my players too much agency rather than risk railroading them.


I have the metaplot and ninety percent of the setting worked out, at least in the abstract. I know where the story starts, and the direction it's going in the first chapter. Beyond there are job offers and plot seeds - at least some of which will hopefully be inspired by the characters and their backgrounds. That said, if the players take it into their head to sail off to the unexplored unknown, there's room for that as well. 


I suppose I was mostly seeing/hoping for player contribution to setting on the level Grey described, contributing animals, locations and organizations without fundamentally altering the nature of reality, so it makes more sense to stick to the GM's pointy hat and save the stylish captain's cap for another day and another story.


Now I have a few guides to review!


Thanks again for everyone's help and contributions.

 

[Grey]

My background is writer, so I'd prefer to err on the side of giving my players too much agency rather than risk railroading them.

As a writer myself, I'm involved in roleplaying specifically to see what players do with the material I give them. I find it works if you have that concrete setting and then the actions of NPCs help form your plot - as in, a discrete event kicks the plot into motion, and you need to ensure that you encourage the players to make characters who would pursue the clues that lead them into the plot. I talk about this in one of the guides; if you appeal to character motivations you can make the players follow the plotline you have in mind even if the form and ending surprise you.

 

[Greenbriar]

@Grey


Good god man, but you can write. 


Thank you from the bottom of my heart for a great deal of food for thought. I was deliberately vague earlier, but I'm writing steampunk - so there absolutely will be sneering imperialists piloting airships into darkest Afrika in search of lost native treasures - but they won't be the players.


At least I hope not!


I really can't recommend Grey's guides enough, they're a bible for the aspiring GM.

 

[Grey]

You're too kind, and very welcome. I hope it's all useful to you, and if you'd like more specific feedback as you proceed feel free to let me know.