[Astrum: Heavens] Announcements / Updates

[Helix Nebula]

As you may or may not know, the system for timing productions in Astrum is somewhat 'traditional', having carried over through countless Nation-Building games, over who knows how many sites. It definitely has it's pros, but also it's cons, the biggest of which is undoubtedly the fact, that doing anything takes a long time- Which, granted, is kind of the point and it makes perfect sense to have to wait for almost a month, for that amazing monument you're building, that'll give you incredible bonuses.. But when it takes a month, just to build a single battleship...


"So just lower the times! Geez!" Hush now, my impatient inner-monologue. Yes, reducing times is an option I'm definitely considering, in fact, times have already been lowered twice, for balance. Yeah- Betcha' none of you knew that. However there is another option, I'm considering, one based on an early draft of Astrum, when it was going to be in a Star Wars/Trek inspired -Universe (betcha' y'all didn't know that either, I'm just full of surprises!) that I scrapped in favor of the current "version" of Astrum. In fact, there were multiple concepts I scrapped, but the one I'm talking about right now, is the; "Point-based production system hybrid v2.8 Pre-Beta Alpha 6" (it's not actually called that, but you know me)


Basically, every nation depending on Population and various other things, gets X amount of Production (Points), which they can then use on, you guessed it, producing things. From units to certain buildings, things would have their own costs and with some exceptions, as long as you had the points, you could produce what you wanted instantly, or in a couple of days depending on amount, whether you're at war and such. If you used all of your Production, you'd be incapable of producing anything, until you'd get more points. Production would be generated weekly, and your Production-generation would depend on your Economic Tier, Population, any improvements you've made, statecraft etc..

[QUOTE="Helix Nebula]
Remember, it is not a static number you can apply again and again! EVERY time you train new troops or build new things you must send a PM for approval!

[/QUOTE]
That would, of course, still apply.


Science, politics and monuments, would still function on the old system and take X amount of days to finish, although with monuments, they would also take significant amounts of Production to build.


I[/hr] could just go ahead and implement this change, but I'd like to hear some feedback from all of you first. Would you like the reformed system in the first place, do you have suggestions for the old one or are you completely happy with how things are now? Discuss, ask, suggest, you know how this works.


And please vote in the poll, to give a clear image where everyone stands. I'll be keeping the floor open at least until next Sunday or until everyone has given me some indication of having read this thread.


:cool:


(Note; Ignore my vote in the poll)

 

[highdarklord]

I think this works just fine considering we aren't engaged in player vs. player combat at this point, which means ability to produce our stuff the way we want works best and rewards continued activity on at least a weekly basis, and if it would technically help speed up updates... The questions I have:


Do unused points from a previous week get carried over?


Would we be able to do a "Points for days" kind of trade? Where if we wanted to say, build more at once but were willing to wait for it to be functional we'd be able to extend a build time on it and save on production points.


More to follow as I think of them.

 

[Freeman]

Well form what I have seen as the real problem to all this is not the times, but the research aspects of it. Its easy for any new player to NBRPs to just PM a set of production orders, its just basically a copy and paste job of what you have in your military part of your nation thread. The problem I have seen when it comes to new players is them building their own technology and monuments. I think that the tech advancement and a lot of the ambiguous parts of research and social production is really the problem.


I propose a Tech-Tree needs to be of some sort to help out new player, though they can take insite and fallow the tech-tree like for all the things we will all produce at one point, Bigger Ships, Laser Weapons, Shields ect ect. Though leave room were they can branch off in their own unique technology.


But honestly if I meet Wolf right now, my ships would far out match his in technology, because he did not do the amount of work for technology as I have. (excluding for the fact that I played for a year straight...) But while I can do things my own way, Wolf, or any new players can fallow a Tech-Tree to help them out with more basic of technology. So that when they go up to a player they will be on the same par-or-so as the other.

 

[Helix Nebula]

I think this works just fine considering we aren't engaged in player vs. player combat at this point, which means ability to produce our stuff the way we want works best and rewards continued activity on at least a weekly basis, and if it would technically help speed up updates... The questions I have:
Do unused points from a previous week get carried over?


Would we be able to do a "Points for days" kind of trade? Where if we wanted to say, build more at once but were willing to wait for it to be functional we'd be able to extend a build time on it and save on production points.


More to follow as I think of them.

Yes to the first question and most likely not, to the second one. Only cases where one would have to wait, would be major projects- Monuments and Death Stars, that sort of thing. Trading points for days, also wouldn't make a helluva' lot of sense from an in-game point of view, as you'd essentially be stalling the construction/production of something, just to use a smaller workforce, to no real benefit whatsoever.

Well form what I have seen as the real problem to all this is not the times, but the research aspects of it. Its easy for any new player to NBRPs to just PM a set of production orders, its just basically a copy and paste job of what you have in your military part of your nation thread. The problem I have seen when it comes to new players is them building their own technology and monuments. I think that the tech advancement and a lot of the ambiguous parts of research and social production is really the problem.
I propose a Tech-Tree needs to be of some sort to help out new player, though they can take insite and fallow the tech-tree like for all the things we will all produce at one point, Bigger Ships, Laser Weapons, Shields ect ect. Though leave room were they can branch off in their own unique technology.


But honestly if I meet Wolf right now, my ships would far out match his in technology, because he did not do the amount of work for technology as I have. (excluding for the fact that I played for a year straight...) But while I can do things my own way, Wolf, or any new players can fallow a Tech-Tree to help them out with more basic of technology. So that when they go up to a player they will be on the same par-or-so as the other.

I agree with you and I have been working towards creating a, "tech-tree" (I use this term very loosely), or more of a "guide-tree", to help players both new and old, along with research in Astrum, without forcing them down a certain path or holding their hand too much, but (hopefully) still providing enough insight into how the system works to be useful and self-explanatory. I'm also likely going to reduce the time it takes to research certain techs, significantly.


However, what are your thoughts on the suggested 'production reform', specifically?

 

[Freeman]

Well in this 'Guide-tree' there could be a little thing for shields, mostly just the basic, and what steps you have to take to get to them if there is any. But that will just be it simple shields, now if you want Metaphasic, or faster recharging or even stronger shields, that should be left up to the creativity of the individual player.


As for the idea it self, I don't know about weekly allowances, but a point system for building mass amounts of troops or ships would come in handy.

 

[Helix Nebula]

Well in this 'Guide-tree' there could be a little thing for shields, mostly just the basic, and what steps you have to take to get to them if there is any. But that will just be it simple shields, now if you want Metaphasic, or faster recharging or even stronger shields, that should be left up to the creativity of the individual player.

I know what a tech-tree looks like Freeman!!! :tongue:


I say, 'guide-tree', because constructing an actual tech-tree, would take forever and likely remove freedom of choice. It's essentially a collection of the most basic techs, players would usually do early on in the game.

As for the idea it self, I don't know about weekly allowances, but a point system for building mass amounts of troops or ships would come in handy.

The weekly production income, wouldn't be the only way you could garner.. Pro-Points (lol), they could also be obtained through statecraft, research, reform and possibly even exploration. There would also be some repercussions to just spamming thousands upon thousands of troops or ships, for an example; A 'cooldown' period, where if you've been too expansionist with your military (or even infrastructure), you'll have to wait X amount of days before you can produce anything, or might even end up hurting yourself economically.


Don't quite quote me on that yet, however, as I'm still working on balancing it. I'm even considering making the Popularity-factor for each nation publicly visible and incorporate that.. But it remains to be seen.

 

[Freeman]

[QUOTE="Helix Nebula]I know what a tech-tree looks like Freeman!!! :tongue:
Don't quite quote me on that yet, however, as I'm still working on balancing it. I'm even considering making the Popularity-factor for each nation publicly visible and incorporate that.. But it remains to be seen.

[/QUOTE]
Pop-a-wat? That would help a bit in the case of reforms

 

[Helix Nebula]

Pop-a-wat? That would help a bit in the case of reforms

It's the collection of all the effects of 'metagame' events, reforms, research, monuments and some other factors, formed into a variable that determines the happiness of your population, how supportive of you they are, how well they'll respond to social reforms and various other events, including their position towards alien races and diplomacy.


Of course, if I do make that value public, it'll be less informative and more of a broad figure of the general happiness level in your spacefaring empire and, once your colonies start to thrive, how happy they are. I'd also display the largest variables, so you could get some image of what you're doing wrong/right.

 

[highdarklord]

I personally am ok with not knowing that number...

 

[Helix Nebula]

I personally am ok with not knowing that number...

Any particular reason?

 

[Wolf Rawrrr]

Wolf is largely neutral toward the whole matter. Judging from the votes though, it would seem that this system update will happen - and that's fine by me I guess. Any way the wind blows. I just don't want things to get too complicated *bark*

 

[Helix Nebula]

[QUOTE="Wolf Rawrrr]Wolf is largely neutral toward the whole matter. Judging from the votes though, it would seem that this system update will happen - and that's fine by me I guess. Any way the wind blows. I just don't want things to get too complicated *bark*

[/QUOTE]
Old system: Production and construction of units, buildings and such, takes X amount of days to complete.


Reformed system: Production and construction of most units/buildings, is instantaneous and are purchased for X amount of Production. Total amount of production is limited and is generated weekly, based upon various different things.

 

[highdarklord]

I don't want to know it because I feel like it takes away from our freeform RP experiance. As is, we focus on building our nations the way we want to, forming things the way we want to. As soon as a number is made public to us that we know can benefit us by getting hihg, we'll start catering to it, from a little to a lot, instead of RPing our nations straight. At least thats how I view it.

 

[Wolf Rawrrr]

I don't want to know it because I feel like it takes away from our freeform RP experiance. As is, we focus on building our nations the way we want to, forming things the way we want to. As soon as a number is made public to us that we know can benefit us by getting hihg, we'll start catering to it, from a little to a lot, instead of RPing our nations straight. At least thats how I view it.

Yes, but it is realistic to know what is affecting what and how much. At least roughly. In reality leaders would know - through advisors and else - those numbers, though they might be concveived more as percentages or rough figures that would blur things up a bit.

 

[Helix Nebula]

I don't want to know it because I feel like it takes away from our freeform RP experiance. As is, we focus on building our nations the way we want to, forming things the way we want to. As soon as a number is made public to us that we know can benefit us by getting hihg, we'll start catering to it, from a little to a lot, instead of RPing our nations straight. At least thats how I view it.

[/URL] is a measure of your citizen's contentment. A happy population doesn't present problems, and even builds up towards the famous Golden Age period; while an unhappy population provides a range of negative effects for your Empire.

In Astrum's case, the "negative effects for your Empire", would range from occasional hiccups, to strikes, protests and revolts, eventually forming dissident factions and leading into an outright civil war. Of course, as hard as it would be to get super high approval, it would be just as hard to go to the point of rebellion.


Every colony would also have their own rating, including ones you might take from other civilizations- So even if the denizens of Xublar 87 you just annexed, were in open rebellion, it wouldn't affect the opinion of your citizen back home.

 

[highdarklord]

Well then why not. An overall rating and a by colony rating would be nice to possess.

 

[Wolf Rawrrr]

After some consideration I guess you can toss Wolf's vote in for the new reforms as well *howl*

 

[highdarklord]

So do we have a final decision?

 

[Wolf Rawrrr]

I was wondering the same. 2 votes pro, 3 undecided... and of those three, I think everyone expressed a positive or neutral standing. So it looks like the vote has passed.


Though I bet Lareo is already working on the update

 

[Helix Nebula]

Going by the poll and posts, yeah the change is happening- However as I have to rewrite parts of the Main Guide for it and find a way to seamlessly incorporate the new features, it won't be an overnight change. I'll also be taking advantage of it, to give a general update to some of the INFO-tagged threads, that either haven't served their intended purpose, or are out of date.

 

[highdarklord]

Wooooot, updates of some kind at least then.

 

[Helix Nebula]

Production updates should be coming before this weekend so tomorrow or on Friday. This is also why production PMs have been delayed (even further, I know, I know), but rest assured- You'll be building machines of destruction and murder again, soon enough!


In the mean time, admire this little teaser;

Kenya guess what that's for? :cool:


Whatever it is, it'll be taking quite a bit longer.. If I end up adding it at all, it's a bit more difficult! :tongue:

 

[Wolf Rawrrr]

Are those... no, it can't be... blueprints?

 

[highdarklord]

If I have to legitly design the interiors of my flagship... or the like... I swear... I will freak... and it probably won't be a very good one xD

 

[Helix Nebula]

[QUOTE="Wolf Rawrrr]Are those... no, it can't be... blueprints? ops:

[/QUOTE]

If I have to legitly design the interiors of my flagship... or the like... I swear... I will freak... and it probably won't be a very good one xD