The Realm as Atlantis: an excuse for Elephant cavalry

[Spook]

the Realm seems to have a distant thematic connection with Atlantis


-orichalcum (well the old realm at least)


-Giant sea-faring empire that dominates it's nieghbors


-it is a big Island-continent


-superscience magitek (yeah yeah for modern interpretations only)


granted there are a few things missing, like the Elephants, and the Imperial City needing canals, but I think its a good enough hook to add a few tweeks to the Realm to add more of an Atlantean flavor.


So from now on all the legions of the Realm will be equipped with several fang sized detachments of Elephantine Cavalry. Heavily barded, tusks sharpened, and manned by elite unexalted members of the Dynasty recruited into the Legions. These units will smash into enemy formations allowing the Imperial Foot to exploit gaps in formation, bring its superior organisation to bear, and tear pachederm sized holes in the enemy morale.


.

 

[Flagg]

I've never heard of elephants in referrence to Atlantis before, but the idea sounds cool. Didn't Hannibal use them as cavalry?


All I can really think of when I hear "elephant cavalry" is the Mumakil from LoTR.


-S

 

[Haku1]

That sounds cool... Hmmm....


Given that elephant riders occassionally have a Howdah (a canopy seat), might it not possible that if said howdah is crafted of jade alloyed with metal or stone, that you can get Dragonblooded elephant riders... who can exercise their charms...


Yes... Dragonblooded ride charms are very viable in this set-up...

 

[Joseph]

I have never heard of elephant cavalry being associated with Atlantis. Personally I think it sounds more like something you would see Lunar-led Barbarians using than the Realm, but if you can drive your stories with it I suppose I do not see why not.


Personally I would rather give the Realm Magitek Armor from FF VI (and no, Warstriders don't count, being the lame to Magitek Armor's cool).

 

[Persell]

Well if your looking for some good references for Atlantis and combinding it with Exalted. Check out Rifts: World Book 1: Atlantis. A great book and really super cool.

 

[Andrew02]

I don't know much about elephants, but wouldn't they be more of a pain in the ass than horses? If memory serves, the limitations of horses are why most Legions do not have their own cavalry built in and rely on local satraps to provide them if needed. Though, I guess Ang-Teng gets good enough mileage out its elephants, though they do not have to send their Legions all over Creation.


Plus . . . mice. An enterprising group of Lunars turning into mice would route the elephant cavalry with panache and stunts.

 

[Flagg]

Plus . . . mice. An enterprising group of Lunars turning into mice would route the elephant cavalry with panache and stunts.

Or peanuts. Lunars with peanuts!


-S

 

[Catatonik]

Well if your looking for some good references for Atlantis and combinding it with Exalted. Check out Rifts: World Book 1: Atlantis. A great book and really super cool.

I love the idea of infusing Atlantaean elements ..but not from Rifts *cries*


Okay, that's my big anti-Palladium rant of the day


Anyhoo, for those looking for an unusual and intruiging look at Atlantis, I highly reccomend Clive Cusslers Atlantis Found.

 

[Spook]

well you can blame Plato for the Elephants, but i don't think it mentions the Atlanteans using them as a cavaltry force

Plato is very specific on the presence of elephants in Atlantis. In his Critias, the philosopher writes:
"There were a great number of elephants in the island, for there was ample provision of food for all sorts of animals... including for the animal which is the largest and the most voracious of all."

http://www.atlan.org/articles/checklist/


AS for using Rifts ATlantis, its been a while since i looked at WB2 but I swear its not very mythical with is cthlhu merchants, monkeymen, gargoyles and giantbugs

 

[greasy golem gunk]

YOINK!


Consider it stolen.  Oilephants are much cooler than horses anyhow, and given their size/scale, could give warstriders something to worry about.  With or without the aforementioned jade/metal howda, it might be big and tough enough to soak elemental animas.  Maybe?  


Using warelephants would probably make Warstriders worthwhile in more battles, as opposed to simply being there to break walls or run away from The Juggernaut.  


As long as I'm thinking about elephants, I'm thinking that Earth elementals would be the most likely to resemble them.  BIG, STRONG, ENDURING and ugly, I believe that they fit with the earth element well.  Perhaps crack elephant cavalry would ride upon elementally blooded mounts?  


-g3


Their soldiers work for peanuts?

 

[Coyotekin]

I just don't see the Dragon-Blooded using elephants. I definately see the Lunars doing it. Kind of that large and in charge feeling you get when you see them coming your way, especially as a large barbarian horde with the howdahs and archers in them firing from on high.

 

[Athrun the Bear]

I just don't see the Dragon-Blooded using elephants. I definately see the Lunars doing it. Kind of that large and in charge feeling you get when you see them coming your way, especially as a large barbarian horde with the howdahs and archers in them firing from on high.

I've had a stompin' good time with elephants in the past.  I was running a DB game and the players all thought they were so great with their Legions and the other npc Dragon Blooded running around.  They went to stop a barbarian uprising in the southeast, expecting an easy victory.  The barbarians, however, were skilled elephant riders and the Legions started to go squish.  When one of the elephants charged the PCs, they all got a good laugh out of it.  When all the barbarians on top of it jumped off and it kept coming, they kept laughing.  When the elephant started running on its hind legs and its forelegs grew hands (weilding hook sowrds) and just generally became all Lunarish without getting any smaller, they stopped laughing.  Two of the six PCs survived.  So did the Lunar and his barbarian horde.  The three Legions...not so much.  The two who survived went back to the Blessed Isle...the game basically ended, and we started a new one.


Many elephants lost their lives that day, though...nasty Dragon Blooded.  Speaking of which, undead elephants are lots of fun too.

 

[Flagg]

I've had a stompin' good time with elephants in the past.

You're banned from the forums for a week. I suggest you take this time to relfect on your reckless use of terrible puns.


-S

 

[Coyotekin]

LOL

 

[Spook]

I just don't see the Dragon-Blooded using elephants. I definately see the Lunars doing it. Kind of that large and in charge feeling you get when you see them coming your way, especially as a large barbarian horde with the howdahs and archers in them firing from on high.

I was suggesting that elite mortal Dynasts would pilot the elephants and tear into heavey enemy formations and flanks to make a soft spot for the Dragon Blooded superheavy foot finish off the enemy army.


Elephants have a place in civilized armies, Carthage, India, Persia, and all of those fit into Exalteds mega-bronze age feel.,

 

[Andrew02]

Elephants have a place in civilized armies, Carthage, India, Persia, and all of those fit into Exalteds mega-bronze age feel.,

Certainly. Very valid. But the Realm does not even use standard cavalry. For what the Legions do, if they can't handle domesticated horses, I don't think elephants are going to be more feasible. Presumably, the Realm can even deal with elephant cavalry effectively, as they have conquered Ang-Teng.

 

[Spook]

well I'm going for a "feel" and in this cae it means mucking with Legion logistics and doctrine to accept elephent cavalry.


I'm not just dropping them in, I'm purposefully changing the Realm to be a bit more Atlantisee.

 

[Coyotekin]

The whole elephants in Atlantis thing still doesn't seem to click for some reason. I am not sure why, but maybe it's just me. And it doesn't seem fitting to me to have them in a Roman Empire meets Japanese Shogunate organization.

 

[Andrew02]

I'm not getting the whole Atlantis = elephant cavalry, either.

 

[Coyotekin]

Somebody had brought up a reference to some material earlier on in the thread, but it still doesn't seem to fit for reasons I can't quite explain. I think the point is moot anyways.

 

[Andrew02]

I never bothered to follow the link that backed up the attribution of elephants as being a part of Atlantis. Elephants just don't interest me all that much. They do not seem particularly practical or especially astounding in terms of being an especially heavy cavalry unit. Tyrant Lizards, Claw Striders, pterodactyls, or whatever would be neater. The Realm could really get more mileage out of dinosaurs.

 

[Coyotekin]

I did like the elephant Lunar idea though.

 

[Spook]

The whole elephants in Atlantis thing still doesn't seem to click for some reason.

Well it's there in the folklore,  


I just don't understand the resistence to it, skyships, tyrant lizards, and warstirders are all ok, but elephents are to far fetched?

 

[Andrew02]

I just don't understand the resistence to it, skyships, tyrant lizards, and warstirders are all ok, but elephents are to far fetched?

It should be fairly clear now that several of us are used to Atlantis being presented in ways that omit Plato's mention of elephants. Even with that, Exalted is not a carbon copy of its sources and omits details at whim.


Elephants are banal and boring. Your arguments to support it are boring. Considerations that make elephants difficult to accept can be ignored if the alternative is of superior coolness. Better options exist. Ang-Teng already has elephant cavalry and it did not do them a lot of good, ever.


Skyships and warstriders have canonical support as being a part of a Dragon-Blooded supported infrastructure in the past and in contemporary Age of Sorrows (the merest tweak allows the Realm to exceed Lookshy in magitechnological wonders; we need merely say the Realm carefully managed and was not wasteful of its stockpiles of 1st Age and Shogunate weaponry).


And so on and so forth.


Personally, I have always been underwhelmed by elephants, whether it was when I went to the circus, to the zoo, or whatever. Even the scene in the Return of the King film failed to create the impression that the beasts that looked like elephants were much of a threat to anyone.


A group amazons riding zebras is more intimidating and interesting.

 

[Spook]

Elephants are banal and boring.

well good for you.  but i guess that would go double for the rest of the Realms military wich is just a banal boring rip of the Roman Legions, right down to the distaste for cavalry.

Your arguments to support it are boring.

except your arguements against it are pretty much "me no like, you stupid!"

Better options exist. Ang-Teng already has elephant cavalry and it did not do them a lot of good, ever.

Except the Legions are a bit more "meat and potatoes" to run around willy-nilly using dinosaurs, elephants are a bit more grounded fitting into the bronze age feel, AND a part of the Atlantis myth along with the fact that Rome:TotalWar makes it clear that Elephents smashing into enemy lines are cool.  Which is more then enough for me.  I just find it wierd that tweaking the Realm to have always having used Elephents makes the game so alien to you that you can't relate it.  And for that I'm sorry.