Bizarre Lunar Question

G

Gtroc

Member
Have any of you ever had a player ask to play a lunar, with "human" as their totem. this question has recently come up, and I am unsure as to how to handle it.
 
When I was reading the Lunars it struck me as possible indeed, there is nothing that says that you can't. However it seems very limitting. The player would have either two or four natural human forms. The four is adding the opposite sex to each of the forms. This could be useful if you play a criminal, you turn the corner and suddenly you're a completely different person for 1 mote of essence. You're persuers would not expet it it is reflexive. Not as bad as I thought actually.


Otherwise it dosn't matter. You can still take all the beastman improvements, creaing beast man might be harder though.


You should ask him if he wants to take limited forms too.
 
I would only allow a Lunar to take a human totem if they were already a beastman before exaltation, since they might not have a human form already. I would also allow it if for some reason an intelligent animal was Exalted- perhaps a human who was turned into an animal by a god earlier in life, or who had previously had a human soul jammed into them for some reason.


But letting a guy who's already a human take human as their totem? That's really quite dumb. The majority of their powers would become wholly out-of-theme for them to use.
 
I wouldn't do it.  The reason why Lunar Exalted are able to change forms into animals is because 1) Luna represents change and 2) Luna represents primal force.  The rationality of humanity is opposed to the savagry of the animal world, and it is man's connection to the animal world that Luna represents.  Being able to have a human totem goes against that.


Besides, how would he describe it when he went into his half-form?  Deadly Man-man Transformation?  It's just a bad idea.


As for allowing beastmen to choose human as a totem - well, mechanically, humans aren't treated the same as animals, as shown in the Heart's Blood background in which human forms are considered more expensive than animal forms.  Therefore, I wouldn't allow them to do it either.  If a beastman is a Lunar he should choose an animal for his totem which will make him even closer to the animal world.  That's my thoughts on the matter.
 
Question: Does this player really want to play a human-totem Lunar, or is s/he just being a pain in the ass? (Or, is s/he one of those people who confuse stupid gimmicks with good roleplaying?)
 
On the other hand if you think you can use it and create an interesting story with this or if you think that the player will make your story interesting by giving him his poison, then why not allow it. It will probably be a challenge. On the other hand how much do you see it impacting your game. If you discuss the reasons why s/he wants this and set up rules to make it enjoyable for the other players as well, you'll probably have a greatful player with whom you now have a little more leeway.


Storytelling is politics and giving someone a boon when you start means he'll be more malleble later.
 
I was under the impression that the starting Lunar is driven to drink the hearts blood of their totem animal.  Why would they be driven to drink the blood of a human?  Are they wanna be vampires?  Id say no to the 'Deadly Man-Man Transformation'.  There are times that a player asks for some stupid thing for his character just to see if they can get away with it.  Do not forget that you are the ST, and if you don't like it, dont let the players have it.
 
My answer is simple: Exalted is not the real world. Humans are not animals in Exalted. Hell, is the word "Human"s *ever* used? "Mortals" is the term.


So, A) explain to your players that in Exalted, Mortals did not evolve from a common ancestor to apes, aren't animals, and were instead build by the Primordials after reverse engineering some of Autochon's experiments, *well* after the animals were put forth onto Creation. And B) slap them upside the head for using the word 'Human' instead of 'Mortal'. This nomanclature error is obviously what got them thinking about Exalted in terms of modern scientific ideas as to the relation of humanity to the rest of the animal kingdom in the first place, which is always a mistake. There is no science in Exalted.
 
So, A) explain to your players that in Exalted, Mortals did not evolve from a common ancestor to apes, aren't animals, and were instead build by the Primordials after reverse engineering some of Autochon's experiments, *well* after the animals were put forth onto Creation. And B) slap them upside the head for using the word 'Human' instead of 'Mortal'. This nomanclature error is obviously what got them thinking about Exalted in terms of modern scientific ideas as to the relation of humanity to the rest of the animal kingdom in the first place, which is always a mistake. There is no science in Exalted.
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Why are many of you being so restrictive. It is a game after all. If you know someone will have a lot of fun playing a Lunar with a human totem let him. Find a way to make it work. Part of the task as a storyteller is to facilitate the enjoyment of the players. Part of that is making sure things do not get out of hand, but another often forgatton part of this is creating solutions so that ideas and requests from players can be implemented in the game to some extend.
 
okay I am one of the most permissive GMs in the world but even I draw the line here


it goes against what a lunar is


a lunar is abnout the bestial nature being brought out


a SOLAR is the one about the pinnacle of humanity
 
the player can emphasize the beastiality in human nature, whereas the Solar emphasizes the higher human drives.
 
Since the Charm "Finding the Spirit's Shape", which is THE Charm for transforming into your totem animal, does not allow human forms, I would say that's a concrete canonical prohibition on Human totems.


However, if you and your players will have fun by playing out this retarded concept, more power to you.


Secondly, as to there being "science" in Exalted: The physical laws of our reality != science. Science is a method for understanding the world. There's nothing prohibiting someone from applying the scientific method in Exalted. Anyone who observes, hypothesizes, and experiments in Creation is a scientist, and would be doing science. I'm sure more than one Twilight (at the barest minimum) has dabbled in this at some point.


If people are going to bitch about semantic differences between "human" and "mortal", they should also try to use the rest of their terminology correctly.
 
I think I'd also object to the idea of a human having a human totem because Luna- and by extension, Lunars- are supposed to be about change, about having one foot in something else, being between two things. That's the whole reason they abandoned their mates, that's where they get all their shapeshifting  powers from, and that's really what they define themselves by.


In other words, the whole point of being a Lunar is that you're not totally human. Nearly all their themes revolve around this. A Lunar who somehow had a human totem would, I feel, at the very least get beaten up by other Lunars.
 
Bizar said:
Otherwise it dosn't matter. You can still take all the beastman improvements, creaing beast man might be harder though.


You should ask him if he wants to take limited forms too.
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And he should call it the manman form instead of the beastman form : )
 
Safim said:
Yay necroposting with an absolutely pointless post.
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You're right. Sorry. That was a pretty useless post. So to contribute with something a bit more useful:


To Flagg: 2E doesn't use Finding the Spirit's Shape anymore. Shapeshifting to your totem animal doesn't require a Charm at all. Actually acquiring the totem shape doesn't even involve a hunt. You just take a shape that somehow reflects you upon exaltation. If, for the sake of the argument, that shape should be a human one, you would still need Prey's Skin Disguise to shift into it, just as you would need the Towering Beast Form Knack if your totem was larger than a moose. So rules-wise there should be nothing wrong with being a "human-lunar."


But I have to ask, why? Lunars are creatures that draw on the versatility of shapeshifting. Beings able to blend the best of human and beast. It kind of goes against their purpose to stick to the human only. That's not versatile.
 
In my mind this ties into the difference between the Lunar and Solar curses as well. The mechanics for both are very similar, but the Lunar curses involve animality and beastly instinct, whereas the Solar curses mimic human fallacies and vices.


Solars = Humanity


Lunars = Animality


I'd stay away from the human totem notion. It doesn't fit the theme at all.
 
i agree with Samiel on this, sometimes you just have to use your common sense when it comes to issues like this, human lunars just takes away from there feel and individuality.


p.s its like solar sausages.
 
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