Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
Sure! Thanks for listening to me blabber on in a rather nerdy way! =)
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Fat Gandalf's Bar & Lounge (OOC chat) - Chapter Five
- Thread starter Purr
- Start date
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Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
In slightly-related news, Cera made 2nd level! That's pretty darned impressive for someone about a day old! Ha ha! =)
Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
Whoa.... Waitaminute... An odd thought just smacked me upside my head.
Sherwood
Are you wanting Tai Chi for Mario because it might get Automatic Dodge while he's in his tank? Or is it just for all of the other benefits he'll get? I'm asking because I've never had things like Automatic Dodge transfer over to mecha combat and I don't want you to be disappointed.
Sherwood
Are you wanting Tai Chi for Mario because it might get Automatic Dodge while he's in his tank? Or is it just for all of the other benefits he'll get? I'm asking because I've never had things like Automatic Dodge transfer over to mecha combat and I don't want you to be disappointed.
Sherwood
Luna's Concubine
Well, yes, I was hoping to have access to the Auto Dodge with my tank. Why wouldn't it transfer to work in a mecha? If it doesn't, I may rethink my selection.
Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
The answer is design and physics.
I am perfectly willing to allow a protoculture-driven mecha to do what is within its capabilities to do. This is a roleplaying game after all. There are, however, limitations. It has to make sense. Aircraft-based veritechs? Sure! Especially the Logan. But unless specifically designed for it, tanks are ground-based machines. They simply have too much mass and weight.
I mean, I am a martial artist. My training and experience have developed me into a guy who can throw decent kicks. But turn me into a Robotech Destroid Pilot, say, and make me the pilot of any Robotech-era 1st generation Destroid and no matter what I do, I won't be able to get that thing to throw a decent kick to save my life.
But then again, I'm basing this game off of Do You Remember Love and the Palladium Robotech game, not Robotech the cartoon series. Sherwood? Is there, perhaps, some cartoon footage you can show me of a VHT in different modes dodging around with incredible agility? If it's out there, I'll consider it! I'm serious. =)
All I've got to go on are the Palladium books. While the VHT has terrific Battloid capabilities, I am not comfortable giving that same machine Automatic Dodge when its top speed in Tank mode is 8 mph. I mean, our house-cat can move faster than that, and even she doesn't have Automatic Dodge. Squirrels, small birds, and certain gray-haired martial artists I've had the honor to practice with, on the other hand, sure as hell do (in other words, each of these is a pain in the ass to get in on - especially the latter - because they hit back! And hard! Hah!). =)
The only way around this that I can think of is if one were to somehow, someway make a tank that was fast, responsive, and preferably hover-capable. Is it possible? Sure! Is such a tank in the game? You never know! Is the VHT-A1 designed for that? I'm not convinced it is.
I am perfectly willing to allow a protoculture-driven mecha to do what is within its capabilities to do. This is a roleplaying game after all. There are, however, limitations. It has to make sense. Aircraft-based veritechs? Sure! Especially the Logan. But unless specifically designed for it, tanks are ground-based machines. They simply have too much mass and weight.
I mean, I am a martial artist. My training and experience have developed me into a guy who can throw decent kicks. But turn me into a Robotech Destroid Pilot, say, and make me the pilot of any Robotech-era 1st generation Destroid and no matter what I do, I won't be able to get that thing to throw a decent kick to save my life.
But then again, I'm basing this game off of Do You Remember Love and the Palladium Robotech game, not Robotech the cartoon series. Sherwood? Is there, perhaps, some cartoon footage you can show me of a VHT in different modes dodging around with incredible agility? If it's out there, I'll consider it! I'm serious. =)
All I've got to go on are the Palladium books. While the VHT has terrific Battloid capabilities, I am not comfortable giving that same machine Automatic Dodge when its top speed in Tank mode is 8 mph. I mean, our house-cat can move faster than that, and even she doesn't have Automatic Dodge. Squirrels, small birds, and certain gray-haired martial artists I've had the honor to practice with, on the other hand, sure as hell do (in other words, each of these is a pain in the ass to get in on - especially the latter - because they hit back! And hard! Hah!). =)
The only way around this that I can think of is if one were to somehow, someway make a tank that was fast, responsive, and preferably hover-capable. Is it possible? Sure! Is such a tank in the game? You never know! Is the VHT-A1 designed for that? I'm not convinced it is.
Sherwood
Luna's Concubine
I can accept that.
So! What to do, what to do. I am still looking the idea of the second MA. I could cut another skill and go with a more aggressive style, such as Tai Kick Boxing. Would that be ok with you, Dann?
So! What to do, what to do. I am still looking the idea of the second MA. I could cut another skill and go with a more aggressive style, such as Tai Kick Boxing. Would that be ok with you, Dann?
Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
Heya!
Sherwood
Psychie
Kaerri
Captain Hesperus
I don't know quite where this impression came from, but if I put something in my post that indicated both Valkyries were flying the VHT 15+ miles to Florida, I goofed. =) Here's what I recall writing:
I was going to explain this in-game in the next post, but it's probably best that I make it clear here instead. =)
So... the Wild Cards are hovering 100 feet over the water and recovering from their ordeals, catching their breath and celebrating. The configuration of the Valkyries is such that it makes hovering possible, but flying very difficult. It makes for a strange scene. Imagine two Valkyries in Guardian mode, side-by-side, noses facing opposite directions, wings-folded-in, each using one of its arms to keep a death-grip on the 26+ ton VHT being carried in between them. The Valkyries can likely hold the tank indefinitely, but which way do they fly? This is something probably for the test pilot and engineer to work out prior to your attempt to reach land.
Also...
If you guys do fly off right now, you leave Spaceman Sam, Iris, and MechaKitten behind. The Super Tomahawk does not seem to be suited for flying and it should be an amazing thing to note that it hasn't dropped into the water. Only its many backpack-fired thrusters are keeping it aloft. It is lying on its back, thrusters roaring, with Iris casually sitting on top of it.
That's the situation the Wild Cards are in at the moment. =)
Would Sherwood and Psychie edit their posts, please?
Sherwood
Psychie
Kaerri
Captain Hesperus
(bold mine)
(bold mine)
I don't know quite where this impression came from, but if I put something in my post that indicated both Valkyries were flying the VHT 15+ miles to Florida, I goofed. =) Here's what I recall writing:
I was going to explain this in-game in the next post, but it's probably best that I make it clear here instead. =)
So... the Wild Cards are hovering 100 feet over the water and recovering from their ordeals, catching their breath and celebrating. The configuration of the Valkyries is such that it makes hovering possible, but flying very difficult. It makes for a strange scene. Imagine two Valkyries in Guardian mode, side-by-side, noses facing opposite directions, wings-folded-in, each using one of its arms to keep a death-grip on the 26+ ton VHT being carried in between them. The Valkyries can likely hold the tank indefinitely, but which way do they fly? This is something probably for the test pilot and engineer to work out prior to your attempt to reach land.
Also...
If you guys do fly off right now, you leave Spaceman Sam, Iris, and MechaKitten behind. The Super Tomahawk does not seem to be suited for flying and it should be an amazing thing to note that it hasn't dropped into the water. Only its many backpack-fired thrusters are keeping it aloft. It is lying on its back, thrusters roaring, with Iris casually sitting on top of it.
That's the situation the Wild Cards are in at the moment. =)
Would Sherwood and Psychie edit their posts, please?
Last edited:
Sherwood
Luna's Concubine
Got it. Editing now.
Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
Thank you! =)
Psychie
Princess Psychie
Sorry. I misunderstood. Fixing the post now.
Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
No worries! Thank you! =)
Sherwood
Muay Thai is an excellent choice. It's realistic, brutal, and a very effective striking system. It's main disadvantage is that it has no ground-fighting game. In game terms, allow me to point out that both Lightning Form and Shin Kick are devastating at the right times.
In Mecha Combat, again, I have real trouble allowing a special technique like "Lightning Form" to be used in a big, slow tank. Besides, it's a bit overkill to allow Mario to take all of his actions in one round, even if he does give up his defenses for the rest of the round. The Shin Kick in a mech, on the other hand, of course cannot do hit point damage. It is still useable but once per round. But... I am comfortable stating that it can do double damage when it connects.
Oh, and since it hasn't come up, I should point out that Tae Kwon Do's Butjapgo Chagi special attack works just like it says in the book. =)
One more thing. Having studied martial arts most of my life, it is a little difficult to see each system as just a pile of numbers and abilities. You may remember when Cody in your Robotech game practiced Muay Thai? Remember how he brought a little of that "Muay Thai culture" into his battles with him? Almost every martial art system out there has its own culture and unlike modern-day "crowd friendly" Korean sport of Tae Kwon Do, Thailand's gladiatorial Muay Thai has been around for centuries. The real Muay Thai (not to be confused with just "kick boxing") is really serious stuff.
I may have begun my roleplaying days when I was 12, but I've been into martial arts since I was about 10. I love them both! Let me know if you want some really good videos on Muay Thai? Just to give you an idea of what Mario is getting himself into?
Sherwood
Muay Thai is an excellent choice. It's realistic, brutal, and a very effective striking system. It's main disadvantage is that it has no ground-fighting game. In game terms, allow me to point out that both Lightning Form and Shin Kick are devastating at the right times. In Mecha Combat, again, I have real trouble allowing a special technique like "Lightning Form" to be used in a big, slow tank. Besides, it's a bit overkill to allow Mario to take all of his actions in one round, even if he does give up his defenses for the rest of the round. The Shin Kick in a mech, on the other hand, of course cannot do hit point damage. It is still useable but once per round. But... I am comfortable stating that it can do double damage when it connects.
Oh, and since it hasn't come up, I should point out that Tae Kwon Do's Butjapgo Chagi special attack works just like it says in the book. =)
One more thing. Having studied martial arts most of my life, it is a little difficult to see each system as just a pile of numbers and abilities. You may remember when Cody in your Robotech game practiced Muay Thai? Remember how he brought a little of that "Muay Thai culture" into his battles with him? Almost every martial art system out there has its own culture and unlike modern-day "crowd friendly" Korean sport of Tae Kwon Do, Thailand's gladiatorial Muay Thai has been around for centuries. The real Muay Thai (not to be confused with just "kick boxing") is really serious stuff.
I may have begun my roleplaying days when I was 12, but I've been into martial arts since I was about 10. I love them both! Let me know if you want some really good videos on Muay Thai? Just to give you an idea of what Mario is getting himself into?
Sherwood
Luna's Concubine
I also think that the kickboxing martial art will fit better for Mario.
Psychie
Princess Psychie
While it is tempting to go with the second martial arts style, I am satisfied with Toph as she is - for now.
Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
O.K. Let's do this. I think this about covers it but if I've missed something or if something isn't clear, let me know, Gang?
House Rule - Skills - PCs may learn a second martial art system by swapping out previously-learned skills.
I am allowing PCs to swap out some of their selected skills in order to add a second martial art system to their skillset. Here is how this will work:
How to learn a second martial art system
1. You will need 4 or 5 skills depending on which martial art system you're going for. As always, they are listed here. You may take these skills only from the following pools: "Other" O.C.C. skills, Secondary Skills, and skills learned after 1st level. You may not take them from your O.C.C., R.C.C., M.O.S. or the like. If you have two identical skills from different skill packages, you may not take from those skills either.
1a. If you take skills that provided attribute and character bonuses (i.e. Gymnastics, Running, etc.), you must take away everything the character gained. If you rolled dice to determine a benefit (like S.D.C. or Speed, etc.), you must take away the number you rolled. You do not roll a second time. You are giving back exactly what your character gained.
1b. On your character sheet, please Strike Through each of the skills you have selected to swap (please do NOT erase them). Add the text "Swapped at <insert character level> for <insert name of martial system here>." I.e. "Bubble Blowing. Swapped at 5th level for Supa Funkay Monkay Dung Foo.
2. Martial Art systems are learned at the level they are chosen. For example: Bubba da Bruiser has Hand to Hand: Commando at 1st level, but at 3rd level he decides to swap out 4 previously-learned skills for a Tier 1 Martial Art system and thus gain a second, different, martial art system. That system starts at 1st level proficiency while his Hand to Hand: Commando skill remains at 3rd level proficiency.
In-game Mechanics
1. The PC declares during her first action of combat which Martial Art system she is using. She cannot switch mid-round. When the next round begins, the PC can either stick to their initial system or swap systems. If they swap, they then take on all of the combat bonuses, attacks per round, etc. for that system. Technique bonuses (Strike, Parry, etc.) do not stack (there is only one exception). Attribute and character bonuses (+2 to P.S., +20 to S.D.C., +4 to Speed and the like) do stack.
2. The PC can only use techniques from the martial art system they selected as mentioned above. This includes special attacks, defenses, weapon katas, and the like.
House Rule - Skills - PCs may learn a second martial art system by swapping out previously-learned skills.
I am allowing PCs to swap out some of their selected skills in order to add a second martial art system to their skillset. Here is how this will work:
How to learn a second martial art system
1. You will need 4 or 5 skills depending on which martial art system you're going for. As always, they are listed here. You may take these skills only from the following pools: "Other" O.C.C. skills, Secondary Skills, and skills learned after 1st level. You may not take them from your O.C.C., R.C.C., M.O.S. or the like. If you have two identical skills from different skill packages, you may not take from those skills either.
1a. If you take skills that provided attribute and character bonuses (i.e. Gymnastics, Running, etc.), you must take away everything the character gained. If you rolled dice to determine a benefit (like S.D.C. or Speed, etc.), you must take away the number you rolled. You do not roll a second time. You are giving back exactly what your character gained.
1b. On your character sheet, please Strike Through each of the skills you have selected to swap (please do NOT erase them). Add the text "Swapped at <insert character level> for <insert name of martial system here>." I.e. "
2. Martial Art systems are learned at the level they are chosen. For example: Bubba da Bruiser has Hand to Hand: Commando at 1st level, but at 3rd level he decides to swap out 4 previously-learned skills for a Tier 1 Martial Art system and thus gain a second, different, martial art system. That system starts at 1st level proficiency while his Hand to Hand: Commando skill remains at 3rd level proficiency.
In-game Mechanics
1. The PC declares during her first action of combat which Martial Art system she is using. She cannot switch mid-round. When the next round begins, the PC can either stick to their initial system or swap systems. If they swap, they then take on all of the combat bonuses, attacks per round, etc. for that system. Technique bonuses (Strike, Parry, etc.) do not stack (there is only one exception). Attribute and character bonuses (+2 to P.S., +20 to S.D.C., +4 to Speed and the like) do stack.
2. The PC can only use techniques from the martial art system they selected as mentioned above. This includes special attacks, defenses, weapon katas, and the like.
Sherwood
Luna's Concubine
I didn't know about this rule before I tweaked my sheet. I still remember what I had so I'll go and fix it! Sorry!
Kaerri
Dannigan's Lady
Sorry if you've said this and I missed it, but what is the exception?
Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
I hadn't and you're the first to ask. Hwarang Do and Moo Gi Gong are essentially two systems from the same origin. They are designed to work together and as such, their bonuses stack. No two other systems have this bragging right. =)
Sherwood
Luna's Concubine
Two things: in the old Ninjas and Super Spies, there was a character class called the Ancient Master. That class started with three martial arts styles; two of them at level three proficiency and the third at level eleven. The bonuses from all three were specifically allowed to stack. Pretty cool.
Second: Dannigan, in your game can a hover tank in Transport mode hover/fly over water?
Second: Dannigan, in your game can a hover tank in Transport mode hover/fly over water?
Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
Unfortunately not. In the ASC sourcebook it states, "...the Hover Tank can even cross shallow bodies of water (no deeper than 30 feet/9.1 m). I'm just guessing that the Gulf of Mexico is a tad deeper than that. Hee hee. =)
Sherwood
Luna's Concubine
Naah, you just think it is! Lol
Psychie
Princess Psychie
If we are close and the water not very deep, they can just walk back underwater.
Option two, I shift into my battloid mode and provide lateral thrust to Mario's tank while the two Valkyries keep him aloft, and perhaps iris can do the same for Sam.
Option two, I shift into my battloid mode and provide lateral thrust to Mario's tank while the two Valkyries keep him aloft, and perhaps iris can do the same for Sam.
Kaerri
Dannigan's Lady
Unfortunately,
Purr
Kaerri's Man. =)
What do you mean by "...Iris can do the same for Sam"? She's a cool insect-lady, but there is no way she can move a mech of any size. =)
Sherwood
Luna's Concubine
Well, if there is no nearby ships large enough to land on, can the idea of having Toph tow us back work?
Psychie
Princess Psychie
I was thinking she was bigger than she is, apparently.
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