Experiences A clarification

[nerdy tangents]

While I do primarily write MxF romance not all the characters in said romances were hetero. Most were, but I do try to change it up occasionally.

And honestly to me that’s the difference between bigotry and preference. If it really is just a preference then you don’t care what your partner writes. Or your willing to step outside your comfort zone occasionally with the right story/partner.

If it’s bigotry then you never expand your horizons because the real problem is that you don’t approve of/believe in/whatever anyone who doesn’t look/act like you.

Also let’s be honest, your first characters are always stereotypical trash. I know some people have nostalgic goggles for when they first start writing but if we are being honest with ourselves the first character we make is never a winner.

But you didn’t stop roleplaying just because you weren’t great at it right off the bat did you? Even if you relied heavily on tropes or stereotypes or self inserted or whatever.

So when it comes to expanding your horizons practice is honestly your friend. Your first few characters are going to be cringey mess. But you acknowledge that and you ask for feedback.

There are trans and non-binary people on this site, and plenty of cis people who write them too for that matter. So just make a thread saying hey “this is my first attempt I don’t know how to improve it. Any tips?”

People often let perfect get in the way of trying when it comes to representation. Like if they aren’t writing some super perfect representative of a minority character then they shouldn’t bother.

Well hell if you are waiting for perfect for your characters then why are you writing cis het white people? Cuz you surely had to practice them to get anything like good at it.

So yeah I think sometimes people give themselves a pass on not trying cuz they are afraid of critique. But that’s just how you get better.

The first time I wrote someone that wasn’t my ethnicity she was a flaming pile of trash. But the person I was writing with was delighted I had made the attempt. They also got a kick out of the stereotypical mess.

So it’s not even like you will automatically offend people if you get it wrong. A lot of times people are just excited to see an attempt being made. And they’re willing to give you tips if your willing to listen.

 

[Jannah]

And honestly to me that’s the difference between bigotry and preference. If it really is just a preference then you don’t care what your partner writes. Or your willing to step outside your comfort zone occasionally with the right story/partner.

If it’s bigotry then you never expand your horizons because the real problem is that you don’t approve of/believe in/whatever anyone who doesn’t look/act like you.

Also let’s be honest, your first characters are always stereotypical trash. I know some people have nostalgic goggles for when they first start writing but if we are being honest with ourselves the first character we make is never a winner.

But you didn’t stop roleplaying just because you weren’t great at it right off the bat did you? Even if you relied heavily on tropes or stereotypes or self inserted or whatever.

So when it comes to expanding your horizons practice is honestly your friend. Your first few characters are going to be cringey mess. But you acknowledge that and you ask for feedback.

There are trans and non-binary people on this site, and plenty of cis people who write them too for that matter. So just make a thread saying hey “this is my first attempt I don’t know how to improve it. Any tips?”

People often let perfect get in the way of trying when it comes to representation. Like if they aren’t writing some super perfect representative of a minority character then they shouldn’t bother.

Well hell if you are waiting for perfect for your characters then why are you writing cis het white people? Cuz you surely had to practice them to get anything like good at it.

So yeah I think sometimes people give themselves a pass on not trying cuz they are afraid of critique. But that’s just how you get better.

The first time I wrote someone that wasn’t my ethnicity she was a flaming pile of trash. But the person I was writing with was delighted I had made the attempt. They also got a kick out of the stereotypical mess.

So it’s not even like you will automatically offend people if you get it wrong. A lot of times people are just excited to see an attempt being made. And they’re willing to give you tips if your willing to listen.

I have written both MxM and FxF romance in the past, but yea seem to usually go back to MxF. It's what I enjoy most and it seems to fit best with the type of stories I write, namely historical fiction. I have done MxM and FxF in historical settings, but one does need to be willing to consider the implications of being in gay relationships back then. It was not easy and nearly all of them were hidden. Of course writing gay relationships in such settings can come with the extra challenge of not being caught in the act, which can sometimes make for a fun plot point I suppose. Really depends how I'm feeling and how taboo I want to go in that particular story.

As for writing new types of characters, I do tend to stick to what I know I can portray fairly and accurately. There's plenty of badly written mentally ill, POC, whatever other kinds of characters. I don't want to be one of those people. Yes, the ability to get feedback exists, but I've never been good at receiving criticism. It's a self-esteem thing stemming from all the emotional and mental abuse I've endured.

 

[Hootle]

Yes, the ability to get feedback exists, but I've never been good at receiving criticism. It's a self-esteem thing stemming from all the emotional and mental abuse I've endured.

Forgive me, I have no idea what you've gone through. With that said, receiving constructive criticism is how we grow as writers and people. People that have common sense when it comes to the feelings of others are not going to put you down or say mean or baseless things.
They're going to tell you how you can get better, help you improve your writing because whether we want to admit it or not, we want to improve.

 

[Jannah]

Forgive me, I have no idea what you've gone through. With that said, receiving constructive criticism is how we grow as writers and people. People that have common sense when it comes to the feelings of others are not going to put you down or say mean or baseless things.
They're going to tell you how you can get better, help you improve your writing because whether we want to admit it or not, we want to improve.

Thank you for this. I mean it sincerely. I'm so afraid all the time that people are just going to insult and attack me again, or even more so, talk behind my back. That was a common one for my abusers. They would pretend to be my friend, but then when I wasn't around they would talk shit about me.

 

[Hootle]

Thank you for this. I mean it sincerely. I'm so afraid all the time that people are just going to insult and attack me again, or even more so, talk behind my back. That was a common one for my abusers. They would pretend to be my friend, but then when I wasn't around they would talk shit about me.

NP. I'm sorry that happened to you. Some people can be so nasty.

 

[Syntra]

I have written both MxM and FxF romance in the past, but yea seem to usually go back to MxF. It's what I enjoy most and it seems to fit best with the type of stories I write, namely historical fiction. I have done MxM and FxF in historical settings, but one does need to be willing to consider the implications of being in gay relationships back then. It was not easy and nearly all of them were hidden. Of course writing gay relationships in such settings can come with the extra challenge of not being caught in the act, which can sometimes make for a fun plot point I suppose. Really depends how I'm feeling and how taboo I want to go in that particular story.

As for writing new types of characters, I do tend to stick to what I know I can portray fairly and accurately. There's plenty of badly written mentally ill, POC, whatever other kinds of characters. I don't want to be one of those people. Yes, the ability to get feedback exists, but I've never been good at receiving criticism. It's a self-esteem thing stemming from all the emotional and mental abuse I've endured.

Not criticiting you or anything, but I find it interesting that historical settings seem to deter you from LGBT pairings. I mean, take the ancient Greece. Homosexual relationships between men were normalized, to the point where relations with women were seen as 'not real love' and just for baby-making. Similarly, Sappho existed and her poetry was famous, so lesbian relationships (at least during that era) couldn't have been that taboo. I have read a lot about homosexual nuns etc., etc., too. Ultimately, I think it's kind of short-sighted to treat history as one big homogenous mass when, obviously, those attitudes differed depending on the exact time period/place.

 

[Jannah]

Not criticiting you or anything, but I find it interesting that historical settings seem to deter you from LGBT pairings. I mean, take the ancient Greece. Homosexual relationships between men were normalized, to the point where relations with women were seen as 'not real love' and just for baby-making. Similarly, Sappho existed and her poetry was famous, so lesbian relationships (at least during that era) couldn't have been that taboo. I have read a lot about homosexual nuns etc., etc., too. Ultimately, I think it's kind of short-sighted to treat history as one big homogenous mass when, obviously, those attitudes differed depending on the exact time period/place.

This is true, but I don't write too many RP's set in ancient Greece. Even with the nun example it's not like they were open about such relationships.

 

[nerdy tangents]

Jannah there is a difference between having a badly written character and writing a character with bad intent.

I feel like people take the idea of “a Twitter mob” of “angry SJWs” way too seriously sometimes.

In my experience people are over the moon any time you make an attempt at a diverse character. Because they just want to see people like them normalized.

That doesn’t mean making only perfectly well researched characters that offend no one,

That means making cringey nightmare characters, characters that are a little one dimensional, and eventually with practice getting to characters you can share with others without wanting to disappear.

Because that’s what happens with “normal/default” characters. No one assumes you have to make a perfect well researched cishet white person when you first start roleplaying. Most people fully admit to going through periods of doing self inserts, Mary Sues, etc.

And there isn’t anything wrong with those characters as starting points. We all have to learn and practice in order to get better.

 

[Jannah]

Jannah there is a difference between having a badly written character and writing a character with bad intent.

I feel like people take the idea of “a Twitter mob” of “angry SJWs” way too seriously sometimes.

In my experience people are over the moon any time you make an attempt at a diverse character. Because they just want to see people like them normalized.

That doesn’t mean making only perfectly well researched characters that offend no one,

That means making cringey nightmare characters, characters that are a little one dimensional, and eventually with practice getting to characters you can share with others without wanting to disappear.

Because that’s what happens with “normal/default” characters. No one assumes you have to make a perfect well researched cishet white person when you first start roleplaying. Most people fully admit to going through periods of doing self inserts, Mary Sues, etc.

And there isn’t anything wrong with those characters as starting points. We all have to learn and practice in order to get better.

I guess I never really went through the Mary Sue and self-insert phase since I was a writer before I was a roleplayer. Right from the beginning there was pressure to make well-rounded and well-written characters. In RP there's far less of that pressure I find (of course it depends who one is RPing with). Then there's the fact I don't do well with criticism due to reasons I already explained. Because of that I tend to stick to what I know best (which fortunately in my case does not always mean white or hetero).